Date: 16 Mar 99 16:42:44 -0600
From: Chuck Boody <chuck_boody at hopkins.k12.mn dot us>
Subject: Wierd Problem stopped Autoshare
Autoshare has run flawlessly for me for months. (now on 3.0.4) Today I =
received a 2.6 meg message to the listserv which Autoshare would not =
process. I pulled the message out of the Filed Mail folder and all is =
well. The message contains a brief message and a binhexed attachment of a =
ClarisWorks file. I don't think the sender intended it to go to the =
listserv, but I'm confused as to why the message would have frozen the =
machine. Autoboot (or Keep It Up ) not sure which as I write this (other =
alligators in the swamp right now and time is short) restarted the machine =
repeatedly. And of course as soon as Autoshare got the message it froze =
again.
Mikael, I have the message if you'd like a look. What I want to know is =
why it stopped Autoshare.
The machine is only running EIMs (a rather small 250 or so users with =
minimal activity) and Autoshare along with KIU and Autoboot. System 8.0 =
with updated 1.3 OT.
Thoughts anyone (Yeah I know I should update the OS, but it has been =
running without problem and the update list is already over a page long...=
some of which are much more pressing).
Chuck Boody
Analyst/Programmer
ISD 270
=======
Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 18:51:04 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: 3.1 Crashing
At 14:33 -0800 3/16/99, David Baker wrote:
> Thanks for creating such a wonderful program!
Thanks!
> I was so excited about the
> upgrade I downloaded it as soon as I found out. Unfortunately, I am now
> experiencing some difficulty.
>
> We have been using AutoShare 3.0.3 for a couple of weeks now. I downloaded
> 3.1 this morning and tried to do the conversion this afternoon.
> Unfortunately, every time I try and configure 3.1 it either crashes
> the server
> or the application quits.
Which error number? Crash, freeze or loop? See also
<http://www.dnai.com/~meh/autoshare/documentation/#trouble> :-)
Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 21:28:16 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Failure posting to the AutoShare list.
At 17:08 -0500 3/16/99, Cris Mooney wrote:
> I tried to post to the mailing list and got the following error. I don't
> see where "The word get" is in my message. Do you know why it was rejected?
See the section on 'List server commands' in the documentation.
'Send' is an alias for 'get', hence the return message. It is however
fair to claim that it should say 'send' rather than 'get'.
> Also, as you will note, I am posting a bit on the mailing list. Please let
> me know if you want me to shut up.
Nope, we are all here to talk - and perhaps to lurk a bit as well :-)
>>I would like to immediately start to collect procees extenders and make
>>them available on he web. I think that Mikael has his hands full, and would
>>like to take this task on with his agreement.
No agreement needed :-) Thanks.
Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 21:00:42 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Wierd Problem stopped Autoshare
At 16:42 -0600 3/16/99, Chuck Boody wrote:
> Autoshare has run flawlessly for me for months. (now on 3.0.4)
> Today I received a 2.6 meg message to the listserv which Autoshare
> would not process. I pulled the message out of the Filed Mail
> folder and all is well. The message contains a brief message and a
> binhexed attachment of a ClarisWorks file. I don't think the
> sender intended it to go to the listserv, but I'm confused as to
> why the message would have frozen the machine.
Was your Mac actually frozen as in no mouse cursor movements?
<http://www.dnai.com/~meh/autoshare/documentation/#trouble>
explains the differences between crash, freeze and loop. And then of
course there's lengthy processing where the system clock at the menu
bar may or may not be updated regularly.
> Mikael, I have the message if you'd like a look. What I want to
> know is why it stopped Autoshare.
That would be nice. StuffIt'ed please.
Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 23:28:00 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Autoshare documentation
At 10:53 -0500 3/16/99, Cris Mooney wrote:
> Mikael responded to my earlier "550 customization" question with:
>
>>From the documentation: "Or a configurable alert may be created via
>>the Unknown document in the AutoShare document folder.";
> Since there is no need for this ambiguity, I respectfully submit that this
> documentation line be reworded to remove the ambiguity:
>
> -----------------------------------------------
> Create a custom response by putting a file named "Unknown" inside the
> "AutoShare" folder inside the "Documents" folder.
> -----------------------------------------------
Well, yes. It's just that it gets rather tiresome after a while
writing everything in an entirely unambiguous fashion - and probably
increasingly boring to the reader as well. The documentation is after
all not a legal document. And this list is not a court room.
At the point in the documentation that you mention, the AutoShare
folder inside the Documents folder has already been mentioned so many
times that I figured the context would trigger this meaning rather
than the thought of the name of the software; I just never
anticipated the latter to be the case by the reader. I make many such
mistakes and can surely clear up the above quote.
I heard the other day about a fellow, who after having read a very
well-written manual, said that it was accurate, but not always clear.
And the thing here is that accuracy is an objective beast, whereas
clarity is subjective and to a certain extent in the eyes of the
beholder.
>>that is the
>>AutoShare folder inside the Documents folder, where your list server
>>documents are.
>
> Here, I am once again surprised to find that a simple Auto Response (for
> undeliverable mail) brings the term "list" into the answer.
> But, why should I know about
> lists? I don't use AutoShare for lists, nor is this undeliverable mail a
> "list" feature.
I just didn't want to introduce a new folder purely for the Unknown
document. And list command documents are basically auto-response
documents too, so it is not unreasonable to expect the reader to
spend a moment on this. It almost always pays off to know a little
beyond the scope of what you have to know.
> Ambiguous wording, and failure to document strange interaction between
> lists/auto-responses/forms, plague the documentatio. They make it very
> difficult to make use this great product.
And your one example makes it all bad? I can't imagine that :-)
At 13:30 -0800 3/16/99, Glenn Gutierrez wrote:
> I think this has been the biggest stumbling block for me with the
> documentation. It seems that every section assumes knowledge of the
> other sections. Kind of a catch-22 for anyone but the programmer
> himself.
It was fair to say that some sections assume knowledge of previous
sections. The documentation has been designed that way, step by step
so to speak. If you read section A and then skip to section C which
requires having read section B and then go back there and move on
with section C, I can see how jumping back and forth may take place.
If you on the other hand have read the documentation from A to Z and
have come across any obvious cases of catch-22, I would like to hear
about them. Minor such incidents may happen occasionally though and
are unavoidable; I can't very well explain what a list server before
the initial copyright notice of AutoShare, a list server.
> The
> other night, I was trying to figure out exactly what I could control on
> my lists with the 'set' remote email command. All I could find were
> occasional references to it from other topics.
The set command as used in remote administration by e-mail is
certainly mentioned (in bold!) in the section on Remote
administration by e-mail. It requires the knowledge described just
before in the same section, and it is also helpful to have read what
it says previously(!) about the set subscriber command.
> One table with links
> back to those sections could have helped immensely.
>
> Of course, maybe I just missed it. Again. :)
There are many such links in the body of the documentation, but the
table of contents at the very beginning covers all sections :-)
At 16:30 -0500 3/16/99, Christopher T. Payne wrote:
> I too have been frustrated by the level of complexity inherent in the
> AutoShare documentation.
At least one specific example please...
Frustrations come in many shapes and forms. There was once this woman
who highly frustrated called tech support because the characters kept
pounding across on her screen, many of them characters that she
didn't type herself on the keyboard. It was not until the tech person
made a house call that it was determined why. When she was typing
away, she was leaning over, and she happened to be a little big in
front...
The moral of this story is that it pays to sit back once in a while
to get the grander view of things, to get past the literal
nearsightedness. I think (well, I know!) that it was once Serge who
wrote that "go get a drink, install latest version of Autoshare and
try again as if you hadn't done anything before. Autoshare has proven
one of the most stable piece of software I'm using".
Date: 17 Mar 99 08:37:31 -0600
From: Chuck Boody <chuck_boody at hopkins.k12.mn dot us>
Subject: Re: Wierd Problem stopped Autoshare
Reply to: Re: Wierd Problem stopped Autoshare
Chuck Boody
Analyst/Programmer
ISD 270
=======
Mikael Hansen wrote:
>At 16:42 -0600 3/16/99, Chuck Boody wrote:
>
>> Autoshare has run flawlessly for me for months. (now on 3.0.4) =
>> Today I received a 2.6 meg message to the listserv which Autoshare =
>> would not process. I pulled the message out of the Filed Mail =
>> folder and all is well. The message contains a brief message and a =
>> binhexed attachment of a ClarisWorks file. I don't think the =
>> sender intended it to go to the listserv, but I'm confused as to =
>> why the message would have frozen the machine.
>
>Was your Mac actually frozen as in no mouse cursor movements?
>
> <http://www.dnai.com/~meh/autoshare/documentation/#trouble>
>
>explains the differences between crash, freeze and loop. And then of =
>course there's lengthy processing where the system clock at the menu =
>bar may or may not be updated regularly.
I can not answer this question entirely accurately. I can not recall if =
the mouse would move. But I do knowthe mouse would not do anything (e.g. =
I could not manually quit the program using the menu bar), nor could I forc=
e a quit of the machine with Cmd-Crtl Escape. From my perspective that is =
frozen. Eventually Keep It Up would detect no program activity, and =
restart Autoshare. After the set 5 tries KIU would reboot the machine. =
The KIU log clearly indicates this happening regularly through the three =
or four cycles I let it run. Clearly Autoshare was stopped by that file. =
I'll send a copy of the file to Mikael.
>
>> Mikael, I have the message if you'd like a look. What I want to =
>> know is why it stopped Autoshare.
>
>That would be nice. StuffIt'ed please.
>
>
>
>** The AutoShare-Talk archives are at:
>** <http://frutiger.staffs.ac.uk/autoshare/archives/>
>
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> To: AutoShare-Talk at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk (Subscribers of AutoShare-Talk)
> From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
> Subject: Re: Wierd Problem stopped Autoshare
> Message-Id: <545442884771046950175 at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk>
>
Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 10:46:15 -0500
From: Cris Mooney <cmooney at jumpdev dot com>
Subject: Publish Your Autoshare Process Extenders (was: Banning an
Hello all:
>Any possibility of collecting together process extenders and other
>"how to do it" kinds of things for AutoShare onto the web site?
I am not much for talk.
I would like to immediately start to collect procees extenders and make
them available on he web. I think that Mikael has his hands full, and would
like to take this task on with his agreement.
Starting immediately, please mail any process extenders to me at
cmooney at jumpdev dot com. I will collect these and start making them available
within days.
Please send me mail, or visit "http://as.forus.com" (may only be available
as "www1.forus.com" until DNS propegates within 5 hours) with:
Subject: Autoshare process extender <extender name>
---- Body ----
Name: <extender name>
Date: <release date>
Author Name: <your name>
Author EMail: <your email>
Author URL: <your URL>
<60 char description>
<Long description>
---------------
Fill in what fields you can (that make sense), and provide a URL to
documentation and/or required files. I would prefer URLs right now, rather
than getting them via EMail.
This is a very preliminary method for collecting this information, I will
refine it in the future and post more information. However, I would like to
get this started rigth now. Once started, I can look at it and see if there
is some sensible organization, and perhaps a need to provide mirror sites
if usage is high.
The site is "http://as.forus.com" (and "autoshare.forus.com"), unless
Mikael would like me to shut it down. FTP is "ftp://ftp.forus.com/as" (and
"ftp://ftp.forus.com/autoshare"). Currently, my bandwidth is low (ISDN),
but it will increase within a month or so to high volume.
I don't have enough time to do much more, so please recruit authors. If you
know someone that has written an extender, please mail them and ask them to
send it for publication!
Regards,
Cris Mooney
Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 10:45:38 -0500
From: Cris Mooney <cmooney at jumpdev dot com>
Subject: Re: Autoshare documentation
Mikael has been doing AutoShare for years, and I am sure is no doubt tired
of critics (like me) who show up and blast some thing and disappear. No
doubt, doing the same thing for years sometimes gets tiresome and boring. I
thank him for sticking with it.
However, to those of us using AutoShare as one tool in a suite of hundreds,
we need clarity and solutions; we are not in need of diversions and
entertainment as Michael is. Sorry about that Mikael.
When I used a specific example to support my claims about _categorical_
problems that permeate the AutoShare documentation, Mikael writes:
>And your one example makes it all bad? I can't imagine that :-)
When another post claims only that there are general problems, Mikael writes:
>At least one specific example please...
This all leads to missing the big picture: many of us have a hard time with
the docs.
I would like to point out that AutoShare has developed and grown over the
years. This makes it difficult to program all parts of the software to be
logical and consistent in functionality, and contributes to the resulting
difficulty in documenting its usage.
When this problem is supplemented by the fact that the Author does all this
out of the kindness of his own heart ("for free"), it is all very
understandable that AutoShare is no longer a perfect clean design, nor well
documented.
Formost always, I want to thank Mikael and specifically state that the
comments about poor documentation and inconsistent operation do not in any
way imply that his efforts are anything but exceptional and appreciated.
The world, and programming in specific, is a hard place. The problems are
simply understandable for an effort too large for one individual in his
their free time, and no doubt sometimes boring over the years.
However, none of this changes the fact that AutoShare is understandably not
always logical and consistent in operation and configuration, nor well
documented. Again, this is understandable! But can we do anything about it?
>It was fair to say that some sections assume knowledge of previous
>sections.
>If you on the other hand have read the documentation from A to Z and
>have come across any obvious cases of catch-22
Since most users of software do not have time to read entire documentation
for a product to use the feature they need (in contrast to Mikael who lives
and breathes it), these assumptions exemplify the inherent problem. If
AutoShare did only one thing, then perhaps this expectation might carry
more weight. However, the functionality of AutoShare is extensive, and
disjoint. As a specific example, I still believe I should not have to know
about lists and form parsing, just to use the Auto Response features.
Whereas in development Mikael sees all these functions as invariably
intertwined, from a documentation and usage standpoint I do not agree.
The normal user, figures out what feature they need from a product, and
goes right to that section to use it. A good manual has to accommodate this
approach. Sadly, to accommodate this usage might require somewhat boring
redundant documentation. However, this is the more common use of software
and manuals, and thus boring documentation is appropriate. This is not
fiction, this is our only user manual.
Of course, to an author of a program, this is not intuitive, and is boring.
They know everything about the product, and are tired of reiterating it,
and may have difficult seeing what is not obvious to others.
>It's just that it gets rather tiresome after a while
>writing everything in an entirely unambiguous fashion - and probably
>increasingly boring to the reader as well.
Of course it does get boring to the author. However, since most readers
don't read the way Mikael seems to assume they should, it is not boring to
them. What is boring, it jumping to a section, attempting to use it, and
then having no clue what it up. Quickly "not boring" turns to searching,
and bothersome, and then anger.
>The documentation is after
>all not a legal document. And this list is not a court room.
It is neither legal, nor a court room. However, it is all we have to go on.
It is our only user manual. It is understandable that you are too tired and
bored to write "an entirely unambiguous" manual. That is why I think you
need help.
Please also note that the alternative to an unambiguous manual is us users
killing ourselves, wasting time attempting to figure out ambiguity, and
finally having to bother you with "stupid" questions. The common response
to such questions is often your "quoting from the manual", some obscure and
often ambiguous passage as if we should have understood from that.
>clarity is subjective and to a certain extent in the eyes of the
>beholder.
The point being that in the eye of numerous beholders (having commented
here in this forum), including myself, the current AutoShare documentation
is not clear.
>It almost always pays off to know a little
>beyond the scope of what you have to know.
Certainly, this is true. But does it _need_ to be a _requirement_? If one
has time, it may be worth it to learn the subtle intricacies of a product.
However, a decent manual can remove this as a _requirement_.
>I heard the other day about a fellow, who after having read a very
>well-written manual, said that it was accurate, but not always clear.
It seems to me this does not define a "well-written" manual.
Again, Mikael can't do everything. It is my opinion that the documentation
hurts us as users and it is time we do something rather than ask Mikael to
do more. It also hurts us to have to ask Mikael to answer questions which
should have been answered by docs, since he could be spending the time
taking in more praise and fixing the product.
Please take it easy on Mikael.
And, Mikael please understand it is nothing personal...but the docs
understandably suck.
I have started a web page where that I intend to use to supplement Mikael's
efforts (barring his objections). It is currently started at
"http://as.forus.com". And I will post more here on this topic when I am
ready.
Let me in closing say that it is no easy task to write a manual. The
objective is to be both entertaining _and_ unambiguous. A seriously hard
task. We are all arguing for utopia. That is the only way to get better.
Mikael has made a noble start, and I claim it can get better.
But, I may be full of shit. Time will tell.
I will post again asking for help soon.
Thanks again Mikael.
Regards,
Cris Mooney
Date: 17 Mar 99 11:28:49 -0600
From: Chuck Boody <chuck_boody at hopkins.k12.mn dot us>
Subject: Re: Autoshare documentation
Reply to: Re: Autoshare documentation
Ok Cris and Mikael, enough already. =
I can easily see both sides of the argument. If Cris wants to undertake a =
re-write of the docs and others want to help him fine. Go to it. You don'=
t need to denigrate (however gently) what Mikael has done; just do it your =
way. After all lots of products have additional documentation available. =
James put together a good startup documentation for Autoshare years ago =
that certainly did help beginners out. Maybe you can do the same. But, =
it is not necessary to justify that attempt by diminishing what Mikael has =
done with documentation. One can hardly say that the documentation sucks (=
and you did).
And, Mikael, there are problems with the documentation. I suspect most of =
us have had difficulties with it from time to time...often for reasons =
Cris mentions. However I don't think you need to defend it. As you say, =
most of the information is there, but you need to have read the document =
through. And, the balloon help in the administrator take care of lots of =
the other questions. Help out Cris with what he wants to do. If you like =
the end result you can recommend it. If not, perhaps Cris will find =
others will use it.
=
In short, No need to attack and no need to defend. Let's just try to meet =
folks needs.
OK?
(Sorry to be off topic folks, but my reading of the posts on this topic =
makes me very uncomfortable. I would hate to see either Cris or Mikael =
get frustrated and say forget it......)
Chuck Boody
Analyst/Programmer
ISD 270
=======
Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 16:38:09 -0800
From: Camelot Administrator <camelot.admin at lmco dot com>
Subject: Re: Wierd Problem stopped Autoshare
At 4:42 PM -0600 on 3/16/99, Chuck Boody wrote:
> Autoshare has run flawlessly for me for months. (now on 3.0.4) Today I
>received a 2.6 meg message to the listserv which Autoshare would not
>process. I pulled the message out of the Filed Mail folder and all is
>well. The message contains a brief message and a binhexed attachment of a
>ClarisWorks file. I don't think the sender intended it to go to the
>listserv, but I'm confused as to why the message would have frozen the
>machine. Autoboot (or Keep It Up ) not sure which as I write this (other
>alligators in the swamp right now and time is short) restarted the machine
>repeatedly. And of course as soon as Autoshare got the message it froze
>again.
>
This sounds suspiciously close to exactly what happens to me when I receive
large attachments.
+----------------------------------------------------------------+
| Camelot Administrator, mailto:camelot.admin at lmco dot com |
| Lockheed Martin, Enterprise Information Systems, Sunnyvale, CA |
+----------------------------------------------------------------+
Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 18:10:59 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Wierd Problem stopped Autoshare
At 16:38 -0800 3/17/99, Camelot Administrator wrote:
> This sounds suspiciously close to exactly what happens to me when I receive
> large attachments.
I haven't yet received the file from Chuck, but I remember testing a
file from you some time ago, and processing this file merely took a
long time on my computer. I'll post my findings for Chuck's file once
I have it.
Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 12:39:08 -0800
From: Camelot Administrator <camelot.admin at lmco dot com>
Subject: Re: Wierd Problem stopped Autoshare
At 6:10 PM -0800 on 3/17/99, Mikael Hansen wrote:
> At 16:38 -0800 3/17/99, Camelot Administrator wrote:
>
> > This sounds suspiciously close to exactly what happens to me when I receive
> > large attachments.
>
> I haven't yet received the file from Chuck, but I remember testing a
> file from you some time ago, and processing this file merely took a
> long time on my computer. I'll post my findings for Chuck's file once
> I have it.
>
That wasn't the case on my computer. It could be that he is experiencing
what I did. On my computer, it took a long time to process, but when it
was done processing, it froze the computer, or caused Autoshare to do a
quit. I got around it by disabling attachments.
+----------------------------------------------------------------+
| Camelot Administrator, mailto:camelot.admin at lmco dot com |
| Lockheed Martin, Enterprise Information Systems, Sunnyvale, CA |
+----------------------------------------------------------------+
Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 15:56:07 +0100
From: Giedo De Snijder <igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be>
Subject: AutosHare and multi-domains
Hi,
The balloon help was very helpful. Thank you.
I still have a question that the balloon help can't solve.
I am running EIMS 2.2.1 for a default domain (A) and two extra domains (B
and C)
I have made multiple instances of preference sets : a @B folder and a @C
folder in the AutoShare folder within the Preferences folder of the System
folder.
In EIMS I have made an account for AutoShare, bounce and listmaster within
domain B and domain C.
So far so good.
In the Auto:Docs there is a folder AutoShare with all the necessary files
for running AutoShare with the default domain A.
My question :
How and where must I create a folder AutoShare for domain B and domain C to
put the domain specific files in ???
The same counts for the AutoReply account.
Thank you in advance for any help.
_giedo
=============================================================
Giedo De Snijder giedo at beaware dot be
igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be
be.aware : to be digital or not, that'll become the problem
=============================================================
Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 12:26:36 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: AutosHare and multi-domains
At 15:56 +0100 3/20/99, Giedo De Snijder wrote:
> In the Auto:Docs there is a folder AutoShare with all the necessary files
> for running AutoShare with the default domain A.
> My question :
> How and where must I create a folder AutoShare for domain B and domain C to
> put the domain specific files in ???
> The same counts for the AutoReply account.
Specifying folders for additional preference sets is like doing it
for the standard preference set: the folders can be anywhere as long
as the folder paths of the preference set specify the proper location
on the disk. I suggest a path of Disk:Auto: for the folders belonging
to the standard preference set, a path of Disk:AutoB: for the folders
belonging to the first additional preference set etc etc.
Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 17:24:36 +0100
From: Giedo De Snijder <igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be>
Subject: 2 filed mail files are eating up my HD free space
Hi,
Yesterday I have asked a question about AS and multi-domains.
Before I got the answer from Mikael I had all the non-default preference
sets configured to find the path to the same "Auto" folder.
Yes, I know this was very very stupid. I know now for sure.
For I have to work remotely with Timbuktu on my server (server is situated
in another country), I have noticed yesterday that at a certain moment the
AS Admin was enable to communicate with AutShare anymore.
Trying to quit AutoShare failed.
Trying to restart the whole server failed because AutoShare didn't quit.
I noticed at the same time that my HD available space was going down
drastically.
Today at around 3.00 PM I was able to get someone of network company on the
phone and they restarted the server after pulling out the electric power.
With a big smile I have restarted AutoShare and a few seconds after
AutoShare's startup processing the problem was back again.
The cause : 2 files in the Filed mail folder :
b319777a (144,9 MB)
b319777a.1 (7,8 MB)
I have put them in the Trash but was enable to delete them for they were in
use (unable to quit AutoShare).
I hope I can reach the network company tomorrow morning as soon as possible
because I believe there will be not much free disk space left.
That is the situation.
In case they will restart in time, I am more than afraid to start up
AutoShare again.
Will the problem be solved by deleting those 2 files before starting up
AutoShare or are there also other things to take in account ?
Please, what do you advice in this case.
I am desperate.!!!!
What a weekend.
_giedo
=============================================================
Giedo De Snijder giedo at beaware dot be
igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be
be.aware : to be digital or not, that'll become the problem
=============================================================
Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 14:47:41 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: 2 filed mail files are eating up my HD free space
At 17:24 +0100 3/21/99, Giedo De Snijder wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Yesterday I have asked a question about AS and multi-domains.
> Before I got the answer from Mikael I had all the non-default preference
> sets configured to find the path to the same "Auto" folder.
> Yes, I know this was very very stupid. I know now for sure.
Yes, the Filed Mail folder is the one subfolder that you would mostly
want to keep separate for each preference set, and the Incoming Mail
folder is the one subfolder that is most likely to be shared among
preference sets.
Another important issue I would like to bring up here which you may
be aware of is that the Admin should be set to a given preferences
set via Command-U. While the Admin's Preferences -> Multiple
Preferences menu selection and the documentation's section on
Multiple instances of preference sets point in the direction, I think
I'll update the Admin at some time to drop straight into the Multiple
Preferences window, if a multiple preferences environment is detected.
> Will the problem be solved by deleting those 2 files before starting up
> AutoShare or are there also other things to take in account ?
I would say the former. At this time I would also create a Saved
Filed Mail folder (Command-K in the Admin), so if it happens again,
you can send me a StuffIt'ed copy of the message file in the Filed
Mail folder that triggered this situation (I have no guess as to why
it happened).
Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 11:08:23 -0800
From: Mark Hartman <mh-list at harthaven dot com>
Subject: List-related files in Documents folder
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought that files related to lists
or list commands could either be (for example, for the Info file for a list
called "X-List"):
...:Docs:AutoShare:Info.X-List
or
...:Docs:AutoShare:Info:X-List
In other words, that files for a particular command or function could be
grouped into folders named for that command or function, rather than
sitting loose in the :Docs:AutoShare: folder. (And, BTW, that a file
named "Default" in a command/function folder would be used if a file for
the given list was not present.)
This doesn't seem to work for "Footer." Anyone know why not, or what I'm
misinterpreting?
Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 12:25:55 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: List-related files in Documents folder
At 11:08 -0800 3/22/99, Mark Hartman wrote:
> In other words, that files for a particular command or function could be
> grouped into folders named for that command or function, rather than
> sitting loose in the :Docs:AutoShare: folder. (And, BTW, that a file
> named "Default" in a command/function folder would be used if a file for
> the given list was not present.)
>
> This doesn't seem to work for "Footer." Anyone know why not, or what I'm
> misinterpreting?
That's because the folder mechanism for headers and footers supports
rotating banners instead. And that's why the folder mechanism is not
mentioned in the section on Headers and footers, but is mentioned in
the following section on Rotating banners :-)
I would consider implementing a flag, so the folder mechanism here
works in the standard way.
Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 13:01:48 -0800
From: Mark Hartman <mh-list at harthaven dot com>
Subject: Re: List-related files in Documents folder
At 12:25 PM -0800 3/22/1999, Mikael Hansen wrote:
>At 11:08 -0800 3/22/99, Mark Hartman wrote:
>
>> In other words, that files for a particular command or function could be
>> grouped into folders named for that command or function, rather than
>> sitting loose in the :Docs:AutoShare: folder. (And, BTW, that a file
>> named "Default" in a command/function folder would be used if a file for
>> the given list was not present.)
>>
>> This doesn't seem to work for "Footer." Anyone know why not, or what I'm
>> misinterpreting?
>
>That's because the folder mechanism for headers and footers supports
>rotating banners instead. And that's why the folder mechanism is not
>mentioned in the section on Headers and footers, but is mentioned in
>the following section on Rotating banners :-)
>
>I would consider implementing a flag, so the folder mechanism here
>works in the standard way.
Well, if you really want to get silly about it, you could do the following:
o :Docs:AutoShare:Footer.listname (file)
is the standard footer for that list, if present (takes precedence
over Footer folder contents)
o :Docs:AutoShare:Footer:listname (file)
is the standard footer for that list, if present
o :Docs:AutoShare:Footer:default (file)
is the standard footer for all lists, unless others present
If any of the above are aliases, then
o If it's an alias to a file, use the file; or
o If it's an alias to a folder, use the files in the folder as rotating
banners
Doing it this way would make it fit into the other "standard" model,
would eliminate the need for a flag, and would let some lists have
rotating banners and others not. It also wouldn't break anything that
already exists.
Howzat?
Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 22:23:23 +0100
From: Giedo De Snijder <igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be>
Subject: Error of type 1
Hi,
After my problems this weekend i have started up AS on my remote server
this evening.
I can open every menu item of AS except "Miscellanous".
If I choose that option AS quits " error of type 1 occurred".
I can open it an all the rest with AutoShare Admin.
Which file is corrupted ????
_giedo
=============================================================
Giedo De Snijder giedo at beaware dot be
igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be
be.aware : to be digital or not, that'll become the problem
=============================================================
Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 20:47:47 +0100
From: Giedo De Snijder <igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be>
Subject: announcement type
************************************************************
ATTENTION PLEASE
Sorry. Your message did NOT get posted or forwarded
The word List is a list server command
A list server command must be sent to the list server address
The list server address is autoshare at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk
************************************************************
Hi,
This morning I could finally solve the AutoShare HD problem.
The 2 Filed mail files had already taken 300 MB.
Today I have experimented on a test server ;-)
In fact I have tried to do what I was trying to do last weekend on my real
server:
Running an announcement list.
Reading the docs about List types I find the following:
<SNIP>
When a contribution is sent to an announcement list, the contribution is
returned to the sender.
<!--THAT IS RIGHT-->
Only the listmaster is able to post to the list.
The listmaster address is fetched from the administrator address ( from the
Preferences menu, choose Miscellaneous)
<!--THAT DOESN'T SEEM TO WORK (FOR ME)--->
</SNIP>
The listmaster address from the Preferences menu isn't fetched
(listmaster at 192.0.1 dot 2).
Even the listmaster address, within the List window for that specific list,
isn't fetched.
More: if I don't put the listmaster address for the specific list in the
subscriber's list and allow him to post (in contrast to all other
subscribers who aren't allowed to post), the listmaster isn't able to post.
<SNIP>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 13:27:49 +0100
Reply-To: zgiedo at 192.0.1 dot 2
Precedence: bulk
List-Owner: listmaster at 192.0.1 dot 2 (Listmaster_local)
List-ID: aBITmore.192.0.1.2
List-Software: AutoShare 3.0.4 by Mikael Hansen
X-To-Unsubscribe: autoshare at 192.0.1 dot 2, body: unsub aBITmore
To: aBITmore at 192.0.1 dot 2 (Subscribers of aBITmore)
From: Listmaster_local <listmaster at 192.0.1 dot 2>
Subject: test3
************************************************************
ATTENTION PLEASE
Sorry. Your message did NOT get posted or forwarded
You cannot post to a list, unless you are a subscriber
The list server address is autoshare at 192.0.1 dot 2
************************************************************
test3
</SNIP>
I have made the listmaster's address part of the list of subscribers and
also enabled CONCEAL and protect addresses for that list.
So the listmaster's address has got a protection too :
<SNIP>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 13:33:11 +0100
Reply-To: zgiedo at 192.0.1 dot 2
Precedence: bulk
List-Owner: listmaster at 192.0.1 dot 2 (Listmaster_local)
List-ID: aBITmore.192.0.1.2
List-Software: AutoShare 3.0.4 by Mikael Hansen
X-To-Unsubscribe: autoshare at 192.0.1 dot 2, body: unsub aBITmore
To: aBITmore at 192.0.1 dot 2 (Subscribers of aBITmore)
From: Listmaster_local <1290012966 at 192.0.1 dot 2>
Subject: test4
test4
</SNIP>
My questions:
1) What can be the reason the listmaster address isn't fetched, not even
the listmaster address for a specific list instead (unless by making him a
subscriber who is able to post) ?
2) In case it has to be fetched what do you do when running an announcement
list with multiple domains ?
Only the listmaster of the default domain (the domain running the mail
server) is able to post to announcement lists even when he has nothing to
do with the lists of certain domains ?
3) Can the digest account for an announcement list be left away in EIMS
when the digest option isn't used at all ? <list>.d
4) A question about the BOUNCE feature:
Do I understand it right ?
a) In EIMS 2.2 default domain, I make a bounce account, save as
files to HD:Auto: Bounce
in EIMS 2.2 I enable the option send to address
bounce@defaultdomain under the header "un-
known addresses"
b) in AutoShare itself in the Miscellaneous window I put for the
bounce address:
bounce@defaultdomain
c) in AutoShare Admin 's Miscellaneous window I also put
bounce@defaultdomain
in AutoShare Admin 's More Miscellaneous window I can leave the
field "unknown addresses"
empty.
Thank you for your time and attention.
_giedo
=============================================================
Giedo De Snijder giedo at beaware dot be
igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be
be.aware : to be digital or not, that'll become the problem
=============================================================
** The AutoShare-Talk archives are at:
** <http://frutiger.staffs.ac.uk/autoshare/archives/>
_giedo
=============================================================
Giedo De Snijder giedo at beaware dot be
igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be
be.aware : to be digital or not, that'll become the problem
=============================================================
Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 20:18:59 -0600
Subject: Re: announcement type
From: "Jeffrey Folk" <jfolk at qzone.vt dot com>
You might also be having bounce problems. I have had problems in the past
sending mail using the @ipAddress format. The proper format [I am told] for
the ipAddress is to enclose it in square brackets:
user at [111.222.33 dot 44]
Just a thought :/
Jeff
----------
>From: AutoShare-Talk at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk (AutoShare-Talk list)
>To: AutoShare-Talk at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk (Subscribers of AutoShare-Talk)
>Subject: AutoShare-Talk digest 24 Mar 1999
>Date: Wed, Mar 24, 1999, 3:01 PM
>
>************************************************************
>ATTENTION PLEASE
>Sorry. Your message did NOT get posted or forwarded
>You cannot post to a list, unless you are a subscriber
>The list server address is autoshare at 192.0.1 dot 2
>************************************************************
>
>test3
></SNIP>
>
>I have made the listmaster's address part of the list of subscribers and
>also enabled CONCEAL and protect addresses for that list.
>So the listmaster's address has got a protection too :
>
><SNIP>
>Mime-Version: 1.0
>Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 13:33:11 +0100
>Reply-To: zgiedo at 192.0.1 dot 2
>Precedence: bulk
>List-Owner: listmaster at 192.0.1 dot 2 (Listmaster_local)
>List-ID: aBITmore.192.0.1.2
>List-Software: AutoShare 3.0.4 by Mikael Hansen
>X-To-Unsubscribe: autoshare at 192.0.1 dot 2, body: unsub aBITmore
>To: aBITmore at 192.0.1 dot 2 (Subscribers of aBITmore)
>From: Listmaster_local <1290012966 at 192.0.1 dot 2>
>Subject: test4
>
>test4
>
></SNIP>
Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 12:24:05 GMT
From: James Berriman <J.R.Berriman at staffs.ac dot uk>
Subject: Re: announcement type
At 19:47 -0000 24/3/1999, Giedo De Snijder wrote:
>My questions:
>
>1) What can be the reason the listmaster address isn't fetched, not even
>the listmaster address for a specific list instead (unless by making him a
>subscriber who is able to post) ?
As you've discovered, the listmaster must always be subscribed to the list
in order to post.
>2) In case it has to be fetched what do you do when running an announcement
>list with multiple domains ?
>Only the listmaster of the default domain (the domain running the mail
>server) is able to post to announcement lists even when he has nothing to
>do with the lists of certain domains ?
The list-specific listmaster of any list can always post to the list
(again, provided that the list-specific listmaster address is actually
subscribed).
>3) Can the digest account for an announcement list be left away in EIMS
>when the digest option isn't used at all ? <list>.d
If there are no digest subscribers, AutoShare shouldn't create a digest -
so you should be safe without that account. Personally, I'd keep the
account in EIMS since it will be pointing to an empty mailing list file in
any case.
>4) A question about the BOUNCE feature:
>Do I understand it right ?
> a) In EIMS 2.2 default domain, I make a bounce account, save as
>files to HD:Auto: Bounce
Yes. But if you are using multiple preference sets you will want a separate
bounce folder for each set of preferences.
> in EIMS 2.2 I enable the option send to address
>bounce@defaultdomain under the header "un-
> known addresses"
No. Send unknown addresses to autoshare itself, not the bounce account.
Save as files in the Filed Mail folder, or send to the autoshare@ address.
The unknown accounts feature and the bounce handling feature are two
separate things.
The bounce account handles any error messages (bounces) from the recipients
of messages that were created by AutoShare.
The unknown accounts feature allows AutoShare to support mailing list and
autoresponder accounts which are not individually configured in EIMS, as
well as allowing you to optionally customise the response when an account
is also unknown to AutoShare.
> b) in AutoShare itself in the Miscellaneous window I put for the
>bounce address:
> bounce@defaultdomain
> c) in AutoShare Admin 's Miscellaneous window I also put
>bounce@defaultdomain
These two actions are functionally identical :-)
> in AutoShare Admin 's More Miscellaneous window I can leave the
>field "unknown addresses"
> empty.
Yes.
( :-]) James
Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 16:13:23 +0100
From: Giedo De Snijder <igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be>
Subject: Re: announcement type
>At 19:47 -0000 24/3/1999, Giedo De Snijder wrote:
>
>>My questions:
>
>( :-]) James
Thank you for taking the time and making the effort answering my newbie
questions.
I appreciate your help for I know you have probably better things to do.
Let's say in foreign english:
Bushes CAN grow out to trees too, if they are cut and supported properly.
Understanding AutoShare in depth is not an easy task although there is a
big documentation file in the package.
_giedo
be.aware
________________ human beings on the electronic frontier________________
mailto:giedo at beaware dot be
tel 32-(16) 444379
fax 32-(16) 443484
Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 12:45:47 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: announcement type
At 16:13 +0100 3/25/99, Giedo De Snijder wrote:
> Understanding AutoShare in depth is not an easy task although there is a
> big documentation file in the package.
I often think than James understands AutoShare better than I do :-)
At 12:24 +0000 3/25/99, James Berriman wrote:
> As you've discovered, the listmaster must always be subscribed to the list
> in order to post.
That is the default behaviour of announcement and moderated lists, as
the listmaster tends to be subscribed to the list in order to
maintain all administrative aspects. If you would like to separate
the server-technical list maintenance from moderating the list, there
is a section on Moderators, which describes how to allow
non-listmasters to become moderators.
Date: Sat, 27 Mar 1999 11:30:22 +0100
From: Giedo De Snijder <igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be>
Subject: Error of type 1
Hi,
A few days ago I already wrote about the problem with AutoShare 3.1
"Miscellaneous" menu item.
Selecting it, causes AS to quit with an error of type 1.
It is the only thing I can't open in AutoShare.
There are no problems to open something with AutShare Admin.
For I got no reply on that question, I have deleted the Preferences file of
AS in the "System Folder:Preferences:AutoShare folder".
I have restarted AutoShare and after selecting "Miscellaneous" it has quit
again with an error of type 1.
Please, what else can I try ?
TIA,
_giedo
=============================================================
Giedo De Snijder giedo at beaware dot be
igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be
be.aware : to be digital or not, that'll become the problem
=============================================================
Date: Sun, 28 Mar 1999 12:31:22 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Error of type 1
At 11:30 +0100 3/27/99, Giedo De Snijder wrote:
> A few days ago I already wrote about the problem with AutoShare 3.1
> "Miscellaneous" menu item.
Sorry, I've been gone for a couple of days.
> Selecting it, causes AS to quit with an error of type 1.
I have no clue why that would happen to your AutoShare application.
It hasn't happened to me and not to anyone else as far as I know.
Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 16:32:46 +0200
From: Giedo De Snijder <igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be>
Subject: Re: Error of type 1
>At 11:30 +0100 3/27/99, Giedo De Snijder wrote:
>
>> A few days ago I already wrote about the problem with AutoShare 3.1
>> "Miscellaneous" menu item.
>
>Sorry, I've been gone for a couple of days.
>
>> Selecting it, causes AS to quit with an error of type 1.
>
>I have no clue why that would happen to your AutoShare application.
>It hasn't happened to me and not to anyone else as far as I know.
>
You don't have to say sorry.
I have uploaded a new AutoShare 3.1 version to my server and have replaed
the older one with it.
I run in the same problem with the Miscellaneous item : AutoShare quits
with an error of type 1 every time I select "Miscellaneous".
_giedo
=============================================================
Giedo De Snijder giedo at beaware dot be
igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be
be.aware : to be digital or not, that'll become the problem
=============================================================
Date: Mon, 29 Mar 1999 19:02:43 -0500
From: Jerry Thompson <mlists at ppdirect dot com>
Subject: Authenticated Posts...
Greetings,
Is there any way to send an announcement type posting to the list but have
it authenticated by more than whats currently in place?
On several occassions, a mail server was able to bounce the message back to
the list as if it came from Listmaster. This resulted in the least
damaging situation, about 3 additional emails being resent to everyone on
the list. In the worst case incident, over 60 emails were sent to each
person over the course of 28 hours. On a list of over 4000 people -- this
resulted in a few thousand confused people. What made it worst... was that
each time it was bounce back to the Listserver, the email body grew with
additional copies of the original posting.
Is it possible to send an email to the list or to the AS account for
processing with a password in the subject? The subject would then be
cleaned up (removing the password) and the email sent to the list? This
would prevent a strange bounce coming back and going back to the list.
Currently, for the 2 lists that is affected by this... the list accounts
are disabled after the mailing to prevent it from occurring.
Any thoughts?
Best Regards,
Jerry Thompson
Webmaster/MIS Director
PP List Management, Inc.
http://www.ppdirect.com/
Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 01:33:51 +0100
From: listmaster at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk
Subject: Re: Authenticated Posts...
At 01:02 +0100 30/3/1999, Jerry Thompson wrote:
>Currently, for the 2 lists that is affected by this... the list accounts
>are disabled after the mailing to prevent it from occurring.
>
>Any thoughts?
I would suggest that you leave the list account permanently disabled and
use remote admin by email to post. Send the message to autoshare@domain,
and in the first line of the message, put:
<password> post <listmaster@domain> <listname>
( :-]) James
Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 10:55:48 +0100
From: Giedo De Snijder <igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be>
Subject: More curious things
Hi,
Maybe I may not say it but I am happy with the posting of Bob Beims.
It means I am not totally crazy.
I was already a little bit afraid bothering the list and Mikael with more
imaginary
things.
There is in fact another problem with the " Hosts" item.
In my experience the AutoShare Hosts file (like the docs say to create it
if running multiple domains) isn't needed any longer.
I have quitted AS
I have created it with 2 domain entries (one domain per line : the name of
the initial domain = default and the newdomain)
I have restarted AS and running AS Admin , the Hosts window only showed the
initial domain.
So I entered the second domain manually in the add field and got an
AplleScript error (something about class PUSH)
I tried again and could enter the second domain but the first line became
blank.
I quitted AS and restarted, now I got 4 entries (2 times the same domain nam=
e)
So I deleted 2 entries and checked the AutoShare Hosts file( in the System
folder:Preferences folder: AutoShare) and ...... the file was gone !!!!!
Yes, yes !!!
I checked the Hosts window in AS Admin again (with the "All" selected in
Multiple Preferences) and saw only the entry of the newdomain. Very stange
Selecting the default in Multiple Preferences gave only the default domain
name and selecting the @newdomain, gave only the newdomain name. Seems
right to me
I can remember with the first problems : enable to quit AS and AS taking a
lot of memory that I have seen a few AppleScript errors of class PUSH too,
before AS begun to behave badly.
Any ideas ?
Hope my foreign engish expaination is understandable !
_giedo
be.aware
________________ human beings on the electronic frontier________________
mailto:giedo at beaware dot be
tel 32-(16) 444379
fax 32-(16) 443484
Date: Tue, 30 Mar 1999 12:40:16 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: More curious things
At 10:55 +0100 3/30/99, Giedo De Snijder wrote:
> In my experience the AutoShare Hosts file (like the docs say to create it
> if running multiple domains) isn't needed any longer.
This is correct. Does the documentation really say the opposite?
> I can remember with the first problems : enable to quit AS and AS taking a
> lot of memory that I have seen a few AppleScript errors of class PUSH too,
> before AS begun to behave badly.
AutoShare does not have a class PUSH in its AppleScript dictionary,
so I'm not sure what's going on here. Would you mind mailing me
(meh at dnai dot com) a StuffIt archive including various relevant screen
shots (Cmd-Shift-3)? Thanks.
Date: Wed, 31 Mar 1999 20:15:16 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: AutoShare 3.1.1b1
3.1.1b1 has been uploaded to
<ftp://ftp.dnai.com/users/m/meh/AutoShare/Beta/>
StuffIt Expander 5.1 required.
<http://www.aladdinsys.com/expander/>
This beta version is aimed at fixing the error of type 1 that Giedo
and a few others have experienced when selecting Preferences ->
Miscellaneous in the AutoShare server application.
I have not myself been able to reproduce this error of type 1 on my
7500 running Mac OS 8.5.1 with VM on, but it is apparent that the
Format -> None button is out of sequence and as such cannot be
selected if another Format radio button has been selected; selections
with other radio button sets furthermore lose their hiliting. And
this is what 3.1.1b1 hopefully fixes.
The above does not suggest that this bug is the _direct_ cause of the
error of type 1 that some of you have run into :-)
If you still encounter the error of type 1 using 3.1.1b1, try
reconfiguring using the Admin and then return to the server
application. Feedback is most appreciated.
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 12:01:50 +0100
From: James Berriman <james at acoustic.demon.co dot uk>
Subject: Re: More curious things
At 21:40 +0100 30/3/1999, Mikael Hansen wrote:
>At 10:55 +0100 3/30/99, Giedo De Snijder wrote:
>> I can remember with the first problems : enable to quit AS and AS taking a
>> lot of memory that I have seen a few AppleScript errors of class PUSH too,
>> before AS begun to behave badly.
>
>AutoShare does not have a class PUSH in its AppleScript dictionary,
>so I'm not sure what's going on here. Would you mind mailing me
>(meh at dnai dot com) a StuffIt archive including various relevant screen
>shots (Cmd-Shift-3)? Thanks.
I presume this is a Facespan/Applescript thing. I get PUSH errors from time
to time, and have always put them down to timeouts. I don't think it has
anything to do with AutoShare crashes.
( :-]) James
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 21:39:33 +0100
From: James Berriman <james at acoustic.demon.co dot uk>
Subject: AutoShare 3.1.1b1 mirror
...is now available at:
<http://www.dcl.co.uk/MacOS/email/autoshare/AutoShare3.1.1b1.sit.bin>
( :-]) James
Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 12:14:54 +0200
From: Giedo De Snijder <igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be>
Subject: Conflicting Scripting Additions
Hi,
Mikael wrote me about a screen shot I sent him :
"Giedo, it looks from your screen shot like you have a scripting
addition, whose dictionary conflicts with the AutoShare dictionary.
Try removing all third party scripting additions and see what
happens. I myself cannot reproduce it."
Hosts menu item :
An error occured while executing the script of <<class PUSH>> "add":
Can't set selection of <<class LIST>> "hosts" to <<class Litm>> "inpetto.be" of
<<class LIST>> "hosts (-10006)
I am working remotely and restarting the machine a few times to check
conflicting scripting additions is not that simple ( I am not too lazy) and
a real risk that something happens badly.
It is weekend and nobody there to reset the machine if ..
I have looked through my scripting additions and I have two such folders :
One in the System Folder and one inthe extensions folder.
The only ones i can think about which could cause trouble :
1) System Folder : Scripting Additions : choose from List (GTQ Programming
suite)
2) FaceSpan extension itself
Is there anyone familiar with AppleScript classes to recognize what kind of
Scripting Additions it could be ?
Thank you !!
_giedo
=============================================================
Giedo De Snijder giedo at beaware dot be
igiedsn at giedsn.eunet dot be
be.aware : to be digital or not, that'll become the problem
=============================================================
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 12:51:20 +0800
From: Derek Tom <derek at bbdo.com dot hk>
Subject: Type 11 Error
My config:
Power Mac 6100/66
16MB RAM
System 7.5.5
OT 1.1.2
EIMS 2.2, 3000K memory allocation
AutoShare 3.0.4/3.1, 3500K memory allocation
Problem:
While processing a 3.3MB message w/ PowerPoint attachment from Filed
Mail folder, AutoShare causes a system error (bombs out) Type 11.
I've tried both versions of AutoShare, 3.0.4 and 3.1 and both have
same problem.
Previously, it was causing EIMS 2.2 to restart itself (reinitialize,
not quit and restart, nor reboot whole machine).
Norton Disk Doctor reports no errors.
This problem has happened with 2 separate attachments. The first one
was a 'PowerPoint 4.0' file that was compressed with DropStuff. It
caused problems so I removed the file from the Filed Mail folder and
told the sender to resend the document as just a 'PowerPoint 98' file
(no compression) and the same problem occurs.
This setup (although versions of EIMS and AutoShare have been updated
along the way) has worked reliably for over 2 years. Large
attachments have been successfully sent in the past.
Any ideas on how I can fix this?
Thanks for any insight.
Cheers,
Derek
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Derek Tom
IT Manager, Asia
BBDO Asia Pacific
tel: 852.9017.3050
email: derek at bbdo.com dot hk
web: http://derek.bbdo.com.hk
Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 22:58:20 -0700
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Type 11 Error
At 12:51 +0800 4/8/99, Derek Tom wrote:
>AutoShare 3.0.4/3.1, 3500K memory allocation
The default preferred memory size should be fine.
>While processing a 3.3MB message w/ PowerPoint attachment from Filed
>Mail folder, AutoShare causes a system error (bombs out) Type 11.
>I've tried both versions of AutoShare, 3.0.4 and 3.1 and both have
>same problem.
Try 3.1.1b1. I added a little change a while ago which may make a
difference, but I don't remember whether it was in 3.1 or later.
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:56:34 +0800
From: Derek Tom <derek at bbdo.com dot hk>
Subject: Re: Type 11 Error
Here's an update:
I am now running AutoShare 3.1b1 and it has not system bombed out in
the last 2 hours or so, so it's better than before but in the console
window, it seems to be stuck on processing one of the list's digests.
Under Status it says:
Updating digest for list: bayer.m.m.m.m
"bayer" is one of the lists AutoShare handles. Those multiple m's
seem kind of odd.
I don't think it has sent out that 3.2MB message file to the
subscribers but it has done some processing on it.
Previously, in AutoShare's Filed Mail folder there was a 3.2MB
message named "b331daf5" there. Now, that same file is 21MB! Is that
supposed to be that way?
Also, at present, I can't seem to quit AutoShare - it's stuck
updating that bayer digest although EIMS is still running.
Appreciate any assistance. Thanks very much for your time!
Cheers,
Derek
At 11:20pm -0700, 4/7/99, Mikael Hansen wrote:
>[It looks like James is having some network problems or something, so:]
>
>At 12:51 +0800 4/8/99, Derek Tom wrote:
>
>>AutoShare 3.0.4/3.1, 3500K memory allocation
>
>The default preferred memory size should be fine.
>
>>While processing a 3.3MB message w/ PowerPoint attachment from
>>Filed Mail folder, AutoShare causes a system error (bombs out) Type
>>11. I've tried both versions of AutoShare, 3.0.4 and 3.1 and both
>>have same problem.
>
>Try 3.1.1b1. I added a little change a while ago which may make a
>difference, but I don't remember whether it was in 3.1 or later.
>>While processing a 3.3MB message w/ PowerPoint attachment from
>>Filed Mail folder, AutoShare causes a system error (bombs out) Type
>>11. I've tried both versions of AutoShare, 3.0.4 and 3.1 and both
>>have same problem.
>
>Try 3.1.1b1. I added a little change a while ago which may make a
>difference, but I don't remember whether it was in 3.1 or later.
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:56:57 +0800
From: Derek Tom <derek at bbdo.com dot hk>
Subject: Re: Type 11 Error
Another update:
That 21MB file in the Filed Mail folder ballooned to 102MB a few hours later=
!
At that point, EIMS was still running and AutoShare was still running
("Time since run" was still ticking although it still said it was
updating one of the list's digests, "bayer.m.m.m.m") but the server
was being totally unresponsive - as if the processor was being
overworked.
I trashed that 102MB file in the Filed Mail folder then choose
Restart and it froze so I hard rebooted it.
I then got the following undeliverable report:
###
=46rom: Postmaster at bbdo.com dot hk
To: postmaster at bbdo.com dot hk
Subject: Undeliverable mail for bayer.m.m.m.m.m at bbdo.com dot hk
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 18:34:12 +0800
Mime-Version: 1.0
--=_b332a7240000f37a at bbdo.com dot hk
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
The following message could not be delivered because the address
bayer.m.m.m.m.m at bbdo.com dot hk does not exist.
----Unsent message follows----
--=_b332a7240000f37a at bbdo.com dot hk
Content-Type: message/rfc822
Received: from bbdo.com.sg (203.127.117.2) by bbdo.com.hk with ESMTP (Eudora
Internet Mail Server 2.2); Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:49:35 +0800
Received: from [203.127.117.53] by bbdo.com.sg
with ESMTP (Apple Internet Mail Server 1.1.1); Thu, 8 Apr 1999 11:57:34 +08=
00
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed;
boundary="============_-1288492608==_====
========="
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:51:20 +0800
Reply-To: bayer.m.m.m.m at bbdo.com dot hk (Subscribers of bayer.m.m.m.m)
WARNING: The remainder of this 3301K message has not been
transferred. Turn on the ³Fetch² button in the icon bar and check
mail again to get the whole thing.
###
Any ideas why this happened? The list it was supposed to send to is
named "orchard" but instead AutoShare was trying to send it to
"bayer.m.m.m.m". We have a list named "bayer" but none with the name
"bayer.m.m.m.m"!
Also, in EIMS' mail log, I saw several of the following entry:
postmaster at bbdo.com dot hk 3.1MB from
bayer.m.m.m.m.m at bbdo.com dot hk to
That had 5 m's instead of 4. Actually, 2 more mail log entries listed
the size as 3.2MB although that's probably irrelevant. I suppose if I
had a good understanding of how AutoShare and EIMS interact, I could
make sense of some of all this.
BTW, Mikael, I confirmed that the attachment was not corrupt.
Could we have reached the upper limit to the size of attachments that
can be sent to AutoShare to process?
Thanks very much for any insight.
Cheers,
Derek
>I am now running AutoShare 3.1b1 and it has not system bombed out in
>the last 2 hours or so, so it's better than before but in the
>console window, it seems to be stuck on processing one of the list's
>digests. Under Status it says:
>
>Updating digest for list: bayer.m.m.m.m
>
>"bayer" is one of the lists AutoShare handles. Those multiple m's
>seem kind of odd.
>
>I don't think it has sent out that 3.2MB message file to the
>subscribers but it has done some processing on it.
>
>Previously, in AutoShare's Filed Mail folder there was a 3.2MB
>message named "b331daf5" there. Now, that same file is 21MB! Is that
>supposed to be that way?
>
>Also, at present, I can't seem to quit AutoShare - it's stuck
>updating that bayer digest although EIMS is still running.
>
>Appreciate any assistance. Thanks very much for your time!
>
>Cheers,
>Derek
>
>
>
>At 11:20pm -0700, 4/7/99, Mikael Hansen wrote:
>>[It looks like James is having some network problems or something, so:]
>>
>>At 12:51 +0800 4/8/99, Derek Tom wrote:
>>
>>>AutoShare 3.0.4/3.1, 3500K memory allocation
>>
>>The default preferred memory size should be fine.
>>
>>>While processing a 3.3MB message w/ PowerPoint attachment from
>>>Filed Mail folder, AutoShare causes a system error (bombs out)
>>>Type 11. I've tried both versions of AutoShare, 3.0.4 and 3.1 and
>>>both have same problem.
>>
>>Try 3.1.1b1. I added a little change a while ago which may make a
>>difference, but I don't remember whether it was in 3.1 or later.
>
>
>
>
>>>While processing a 3.3MB message w/ PowerPoint attachment from
>>>Filed Mail folder, AutoShare causes a system error (bombs out)
>>>Type 11. I've tried both versions of AutoShare, 3.0.4 and 3.1 and
>>>both have same problem.
>>
>>Try 3.1.1b1. I added a little change a while ago which may make a
>>difference, but I don't remember whether it was in 3.1 or later.
>
>
>
>** The AutoShare-Talk archives are at:
>** <http://frutiger.staffs.ac.uk/autoshare/archives/>
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 07:41:06 -0700
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Type 11 Error
Derek, could you send me a StuffIt'ed copy of the 3.3MB file? Thanks.
Subject: Fwd: Remote review
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 17:18:39 -0400
From: Charles L. Martin <clmartin at theombudsman dot com>
I cannot figure out why I got the following reply instead of a subscriber
list when I send a REVIEW command by email to the server. I wonder if it
is the same reason I have never been able to get logs to work. I asked
before exactly what files I must delete to "start over" with a clean
preferences, but did not get a reply (I think I tend to put too many
questions in each message-so I think I will stop here).
---------------- Begin Forwarded Message ----------------
Date: 4/8/99 3:08 PM
Received: 4/8/99 5:14 PM
From: List administrator, bounce at theOmbudsman dot com
To: GaCAPDirector at theOmbudsman dot com
<password> review cap-list
MainBin:Auto:List Server:
----------------- End Forwarded Message -----------------
Charles L. Martin
clmartin at theOmbudsman dot com
http://www.theOmbudsman.com/Martin_Law/
Alice: ³The King seems so prejudiced.²
King: ³Thank you Alice. That¹s what makes me so eminently qualified to =
be
Judge.²
Alice in Wonderland, Lewis Carroll
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 11:08:11 +0800
From: Derek Tom <derek at bbdo.com dot hk>
Subject: Re: Type 11 Error
At 7:21am -0700, 4/8/99, Mikael Hansen wrote:
>There's a trick that often works in this kind of situation. If the
>letter o is added to the List Stuff field for the list in question, it
>takes a lot less time to process the same file, because the attachment
>is detached at the beginning of the processing and then reattached at
>the end. A file sent to me by Chuck Boody recently took 20 minutes
>without the letter o, but only 90 seconds with. I don't know if it'll
>work with your file, but it would be nice it did.
Hi Mikael,
That suggestion made a big difference - thanks a lot! I did a test
with only a single subscriber to the list but the processing took
probably only a minute or so and it did not screw up the processing
as it did in the past. The file did get delivered to the single
subscriber on my test list.
So now I'm running AutoShare 3.1b1 and for that particular list where
many attachments are sent, I've done the following:
1) Run 'AutoShare Admin', selected the list and clicked the "Yet more
list" button
2) Under the "List stuff" field, I've added the letter 'o' (no
quotes) and clicked the "Update" button
That did the trick! Any reason why this option shouldn't be enabled
for all lists?
I should note that I sent the test file using Eudora Pro on a Mac.
I'd imagine if someone sent the file using let's say Outlook on a
Windows PC going through an Exchange server, there might be some
incompatibility with the attachment encoding method used and with the
above option used. Is that why the above option is not enabled for
all lists? Sorry if I'm misleading everyone here; I could be very
wrong!
BTW, Mikael, I unstuffed that stuffed file I sent you and StuffIt
Expander completely ignored the email message (headers and body) and
just spit back the PowerPoint attachment. I suppose that's what you
got. Sorry the file was still very large (2.5MB, I think). Would you
want to have a look at the message headers (attachment boundary stuff
and all)? I could just cut and paste it in a message and send it to
you.
Thanks,
Derek
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Derek Tom
IT Manager, Asia
BBDO Asia Pacific
tel: 852.9017.3050
email: derek at bbdo.com dot hk
web: http://derek.bbdo.com.hk
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:05:26 -0700
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Fwd: Remote review
At 17:18 -0400 4/8/99, Charles L. Martin wrote:
>I cannot figure out why I got the following reply instead of a subscriber
>list when I send a REVIEW command by email to the server.
><password> review cap-list
>
>MainBin:Auto:List Server:
The list needs to be specified as the 4th word, e.g.
<password> review x cap-list
But yes, an actual error message would be nice.
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 20:03:21 -0700
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Type 11 Error
At 22:58 -0700 4/7/99, Mikael Hansen wrote:
>Try 3.1.1b1. I added a little change a while ago which may make a
>difference, but I don't remember whether it was in 3.1 or later.
Derek tried that, and things went better, but only somewhat, so
At 07:41 -0700 4/8/99, Mikael Hansen wrote:
>Derek, could you send me a StuffIt'ed copy of the 3.3MB file? Thanks.
I let it process, which took 13 minutes in 3.1.1b1. I then added the
letter o (for dettaching and reattaching the attachment) to the
list's List Stuff field, and the process time was drastically reduced
to 90 seconds.
This incidently reminds of another file with a huge attachment I
tested for Chuck Boody recently. The only difference was that Chuck's
attachment was binhex, whereas Derek's is base64.
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 23:00:27 -0700
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: AutoShare 3.1.1b2
3.1.1b2 has been uploaded to
<ftp://ftp.dnai.com/users/m/meh/AutoShare/Beta/>
This beta version includes some fun stuff such as the SetRFC and
GetRFC AppleScript commands to manipulate fields in the RFC header of
message files. The commands are not required for any standard
processing, but might come in handy in a process extender or
something.
The e-mail address in the RFC To: field is extracted like this:
set myaddress to GetRFC Options
{dataFile:"disk:folder:file", fieldHeader:"To:", emailOnly:true}
I have also implemented the standard folder structure for headers and
footers, which translates into a folder named Header or Footer with
files such as Fun-L inside. If Fun-L is a folder instead of a file,
files for rotating banners can be put inside this folder. The often
used folder structure scheme offers less clutter and is called
"standard", because the <whatever>.<list> way of doing it is likely
to go away some day.
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 22:32:54 -0700
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Type 11 Error
At 11:08 +0800 4/9/99, Derek Tom wrote:
>That did the trick! Any reason why this option shouldn't be enabled
>for all lists?
The topic of MIME attachments is surprisingly complex, so you never
know. But if you can enable it for all lists if you want to.
>BTW, Mikael, I unstuffed that stuffed file I sent you and StuffIt
>Expander completely ignored the email message (headers and body) and
>just spit back the PowerPoint attachment.
StuffIt Expander would unstuff the message file from the SIT archive
and then be smart enough to also unstuff the PowerPoint attachment
from the message file! Chances are that perhaps you have StuffIt
Expander configured to deleting whatever is not the final file in the
stuffed chain?
Version 5.1.2 of StuffIt Expander and DropStuff were incidently
released yesterday at <http://www.aladdinsys.com/>.
From: Laine Lee <LLee at utsa dot edu>
Subject: RE: Conflicting Scripting Additions
Date: Fri, 9 Apr 1999 09:11:47 -0500
I believe that Akua Sweets used to cause a conflict, but the latest version
(1.3.2) does not.
>Is there anyone familiar with AppleScript classes to recognize what
kind of
>Scripting Additions it could be ?
Date: 09 Apr 99 11:47:26 -0500
From: Chuck Boody <chuck_boody at hopkins.k12.mn dot us>
Subject: RE: AutoShare 3.1.1b2
Reply to: RE: AutoShare 3.1.1b2
Now also available by mail.
Send mail to =
mailit at stumail.hopkins.k12.mn dot us
with
Autosharebeta
in the subject.
Chuck Boody
Analyst/Programmer
ISD 270
=======
Mikael Hansen wrote:
>3.1.1b2 has been uploaded to
> <ftp://ftp.dnai.com/users/m/meh/AutoShare/Beta/>
>
>This beta version includes some fun stuff such as the SetRFC and =
>GetRFC AppleScript commands to manipulate fields in the RFC header of =
>message files. The commands are not required for any standard =
>processing, but might come in handy in a process extender or =
>something.
>
>The e-mail address in the RFC To: field is extracted like this:
>
>set myaddress to GetRFC Options
> {dataFile:"disk:folder:file", fieldHeader:"To:", emailOnly:true}
>
>I have also implemented the standard folder structure for headers and =
>footers, which translates into a folder named Header or Footer with =
>files such as Fun-L inside. If Fun-L is a folder instead of a file, =
>files for rotating banners can be put inside this folder. The often =
>used folder structure scheme offers less clutter and is called =
>"standard", because the <whatever>.<list> way of doing it is likely =
>to go away some day.
>
>
>** The AutoShare-Talk archives are at:
>** <http://frutiger.staffs.ac.uk/autoshare/archives/>
>
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> Subject: AutoShare 3.1.1b2
> Message-Id: <285887687357147066711 at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk>
>
Date: Fri, 09 Apr 1999 14:10:53 -0700
From: Matthew Hill <happytwo at milepost1 dot com>
Subject: AutoShare and SIMS
Hi
I have a couple of questions.
First can SIMS and AutoShare run on separate computers.
And second is there an easy way to sprat them if they are already on one computer?
Thanks
Matthew