Date: Fri, 31 Oct 1997 06:17:32 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: EIMS 2.x
At 14:47 +0100 31/10/1997, Jose A. Accino wrote:
>Looking on my mailboxes I've just seen that I don't receive any mssgs
>from mailshare list since some months ago. So, although this is not
>the fully adequate site to post the question, where could I get
>latest EIMS version? I don't see it on qualcomm ftp site...
See <http://www.dnai.com/~meh/autoshare/mailshare/>.
Date: 30 Oct 97 16:15:17 -0600
From: Chuck Boody <chuck_boody at hopkins.k12.mn dot us>
Subject: FWD: RE: QM Pro bug??
Mikael?? Others??
I'll try to send you the file tomorrow if I can figure out how to catch
it on the way out.
or, you can just send a message to
mailit at stumail.hopkins.k12.mn dot us
with "addressbook2" in the subject if you'd like to check things from
there.
Chuck Boody
--------------------------------------
Date: 10/30/97 2:48 PM
From: Mike Scudamore
Chuck Boody wrote:
[snip]
>Mikael Hansen of autoshare thinks it is a MIME boundary issue. I have
>limited knowledge of such things, but that conclusion makes sense to me.
Makes sense to me. My test came back with:
----------
X-List-Software: AutoShare 1.4 by Mikael Hansen
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-Ascii"
Content-Length: 85702
Address Book M-Z
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 1997 20:09:26 +0000
From: James Berriman <james at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk>
Subject: Re: FWD: RE: QM Pro bug??
Actually, I have also noticed AutoShare sending binhex responses with no
mime boundary.
Since Eudora Mac happily handles the binhexed part, I somehow persuaded
myself that it must always have been like that, and promptly forgot about
it. Oops...
( :-]) James
Date: Fri, 31 Oct 1997 13:01:13 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: FWD: RE: QM Pro bug??
At 20:09 +0000 31/10/1997, James Berriman wrote:
>Actually, I have also noticed AutoShare sending binhex responses with no
>mime boundary.
AutoShare does not remove non-originated MIME boundary lines (and does
originate them, if none already appear and if configured for MIME QP). The
thing (and this is important!) is though that you cannot go by the body in
a read mail; you have to look in the actual message file in the Incoming
Mail folder!
I suspect that Chuck's problem using QM is the same as Gary's using
Netscape (I think): AutoShare's re-formatting of some (not all)
non-originated boundary lines is too Eudora-specific, causing some boundary
lines to be differerent from others... I am looking into it.
Date: 03 Nov 97 08:51:55 -0600
From: Chuck Boody <chuck_boody at hopkins.k12.mn dot us>
Subject: RE: AutoShare-Talk digest 3 Nov 1997
>Date: Fri, 31 Oct 1997 20:09:26 +0000
>From: James Berriman <james at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk>
>Subject: Re: FWD: RE: QM Pro bug??
>
>Actually, I have also noticed AutoShare sending binhex responses with no
>mime boundary.
>
>Since Eudora Mac happily handles the binhexed part, I somehow persuaded
>myself that it must always have been like that, and promptly forgot
about
>it. Oops...
>
>( :-]) James
Hmmm.. Does this mean that James and Mikael are going to solve this
problem for me? Sometimes the wonderful world of technology is interesting.
I have reports from folks on the QMPro list that say this is a QM Pro
problem. Ah well... I'd certainly like a fix from whomever can offer it. I
very much need to send binhexed mailbot messages from Autoshare to QMPro,
and I can't as it currently stands.... Let me know how I can help
isolate the problem.
Mikael, where specifically would you like me to trap the message and send
it to you? You speak the jargon a bit too well for me, and I am not sure
what you mean by the "responder message" so I can't trap it for you. A
bit of clarification please? Thanks!
Chuck
Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 17:23:17 +0000
From: James Berriman <J.R.Berriman at staffs.ac dot uk>
Subject: RE: AutoShare-Talk digest 3 Nov 1997
Chuck wrote:
>Hmmm.. Does this mean that James and Mikael are going to solve this
>problem for me? Sometimes the wonderful world of technology is interesting.
>I have reports from folks on the QMPro list that say this is a QM Pro
>problem. Ah well... I'd certainly like a fix from whomever can offer it. I
>very much need to send binhexed mailbot messages from Autoshare to QMPro,
>and I can't as it currently stands.... Let me know how I can help
>isolate the problem.
I've just tried this out here. A short text (HTML) file with binhex
enclosure. The binhex was just appended directly to the end of the file. No
mime boundaries.
( :-]) James
Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 09:30:50 -0800
From: Gary Szabo <gszabo at centralia.ctc dot edu>
Subject: Re: FWD: RE: QM Pro bug??
>At 20:09 +0000 31/10/1997, James Berriman wrote:
>
>>Actually, I have also noticed AutoShare sending binhex responses with no
>>mime boundary.
>
>AutoShare does not remove non-originated MIME boundary lines (and does
>originate them, if none already appear and if configured for MIME QP). The
>thing (and this is important!) is though that you cannot go by the body in
>a read mail; you have to look in the actual message file in the Incoming
>Mail folder!
>
>I suspect that Chuck's problem using QM is the same as Gary's using
>Netscape (I think): AutoShare's re-formatting of some (not all)
>non-originated boundary lines is too Eudora-specific, causing some boundary
>lines to be differerent from others... I am looking into it.
Mikael: My problem with binhex enclosures is not with Netscape Mail;
rather, it is with older, System-6-type Eudora, version 1.3.1, which
doesn't know jack about MIME enclosures (sad to say, we still have some Mac
SEs laying about that exist purely for word processing and light e-mail)...
GSz
Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 12:51:27 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: RE: AutoShare-Talk digest 3 Nov 1997
At 08:51 -0600 3/11/1997, Chuck Boody wrote:
>I very much need to send binhexed mailbot messages from Autoshare to QMPro,
>and I can't as it currently stands.... Let me know how I can help
>isolate the problem.
>Mikael, where specifically would you like me to trap the message and send
>it to you? You speak the jargon a bit too well for me, and I am not sure
>what you mean by the "responder message" so I can't trap it for you. A
>bit of clarification please? Thanks!
There is my next project: temporarily locking files in the Incoming Mail
folder, so EIMS doesn't grap them right away, giving the administrator a
chance to drag them out of the folder.
For now, have only EIMS running, then send the test message. When the
message file arrives in the Filed mail folder, shut down EIMS and start up
AutoShare. Once the processed message file arrives in the Incoming Mail
folder, drag the file out of the folder and start up EIMS. Send the
StuffIt'ed file to me, and I'll look at it.
At 17:23 +0000 3/11/1997, James Berriman wrote:
>I've just tried this out here. A short text (HTML) file with binhex
>enclosure. The binhex was just appended directly to the end of the file. No
>mime boundaries.
Send the StuffIt'ed file to me ;-)
Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 12:54:42 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: FWD: RE: QM Pro bug??
At 09:30 -0800 3/11/1997, Gary Szabo wrote:
>Mikael: My problem with binhex enclosures is not with Netscape Mail;
>rather, it is with older, System-6-type Eudora, version 1.3.1, which
>doesn't know jack about MIME enclosures (sad to say, we still have some Mac
>SEs laying about that exist purely for word processing and light e-mail)...
If the outgoing message is formatted as MIME QP and the client doesn't know
about MIME, little can be done except upgrading the client. MIME clashes
between the sending client, the server and the receiving client are
frequent.
Date: 03 Nov 97 17:16:25 -0600
From: Chuck Boody <chuck_boody at hopkins.k12.mn dot us>
Subject: Re: QM Pro bug??
Seems to me you are both correct to some degree, but you both might be
wrong about the problem.
I'm using EIMS as the mail server. I'm sure it speaks MIME, and I think
Autoshare (the mailbot) does. Further, as I have said several times the
enclosure gets to me and is properly decoded if I receive the message with
Eudora Lite. In fact, I can receive the same message with each client.
Eudora will extract the enclosure. QMPro will not. "It's as simple as
that." (Ross Pirot)
Let's keep talking. Maybe we'll find the answer... Maybe Mikael Hansen
(writer of Autoshare) can help...
Chuck Boody
Mark H. Anbinder wrote:
>
>scud writes...
>
>> No conversion of an enclosure required, just a text message to be
read.
>> Something's wrong with AutoShare. It should have something like:
>>
>> Content-Type: application/mac-binhex-40; name="Address Book M-Z"
>
>That incoming MIME-encoded messages will be properly recognized does NOT
>seem to me to be adequate excuse NOT to properly recognize attachments
sent
>by older software that did not speak MIME.
>
>There's a decade's worth of e-mail technology out there that has
included
>various ways of recognizing attachments. The "(This file must be
converted
>with Binhex 4.0)" text, and what follows, let software like the
Information
>Electronics SMTP\QM gateway scan all incoming mail for attachments, and
>deal with them for the user. (If I recall correctly, SMTP\QM and UMCP\QM
>let you turn off this feature to speed up processing of inbound mail.)
>
>Considering how many people are still using "legacy" (read "outdated")
>gateway and e-mail software, I feel it's worth recognizing old means of
>doing things.
>
>=========================================================================
=
> Mark H. Anbinder |
mha at 14850 dot com
> Public Communications Inc. |
http://14850.com/
> 95 Brown Road Suite 210 |
607-257-1831
> Ithaca, New York 14850 USA | Fax
257-1873
>=========================================================================
=
>
>
>
>RFC822 header
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Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 18:59:30 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: RE: AutoShare-Talk digest 3 Nov 1997
At 17:23 +0000 3/11/1997, James Berriman wrote:
>I've just tried this out here. A short text (HTML) file with binhex
>enclosure. The binhex was just appended directly to the end of the file.
>No mime boundaries.
As no MIME was created for the originating message by the sending client
and as your AutoShare is configured for MIME QP rather than QP Always, no
MIME is applied to the outgoing message and thereby at the receiving
client's end.
I put the sample file, that you sent me, in my Incoming Mail folder (of
EIMS 1.2) and received a mail with a perfect enclosure handling in Eudora
:-)
Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 22:10:18 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: QM Pro bug??
At 17:16 -0600 3/11/1997, Chuck Boody wrote:
>Let's keep talking. Maybe we'll find the answer... Maybe Mikael Hansen
>(writer of Autoshare) can help...
There is no substitute for a StuffIt'ed copy of the message file in the
Incoming Mail folder (the copy in the Filed Mail folder would help out
too). I really need those two files to reproduce the situation, Chuck.
>Mark H. Anbinder wrote:
>>That incoming MIME-encoded messages will be properly recognized does NOT
>>seem to me to be adequate excuse NOT to properly recognize attachments
>>sent by older software that did not speak MIME.
Mark is correct of course. And James's example (see earlier today) clearly
shows that AutoShare handles this correctly.
--
Mikael Hansen <mailto:meh at dnai.com> <http://www.dnai dot com/~meh/autoshare/>
From: Vince <vince at wino dot com>
Subject: Digest
Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 02:05:59 +0000
I had an interesting thing happen today. Someone subscribed to one of my
lists and Autoshare sent them the complete digest. It was about 500k and
was rejected by hotmail. What got turned on to have Autoshare send them the
digest with a simple sub command? I have never had this happen before ? I
checked their original request, and it was a simple, sub <listname>
<yourname>
Thanks,
Vince
Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 12:32:30 +0000
From: James Berriman <J.R.Berriman at staffs.ac dot uk>
Subject: RE: MIME
At 02:59 4/11/97, Mikael Hansen wrote:
>As no MIME was created for the originating message by the sending client
>and as your AutoShare is configured for MIME QP rather than QP Always, no
>MIME is applied to the outgoing message and thereby at the receiving
>client's end.
I don't mind admitting that initially I was completely confused by this
terminology ;-)
So let's see if I get this straight.
If I set AutoShare to MIME QP, then it will only create a multipart mime
response when the incoming message contains QP encoding. Otherwise, any
binhexed attachment is just appended directly to the message body.
If I set it to QP Always, AutoShare will send all responses as QP, and
those with binhex attachments as multipart mime messages. That right?
In which case, a possible answer to Chuck's problem is presumably to turn
on QP Always.
Still, I'm sure there is a Very Good Case(TM) to be made for sending
responses with binhex attachments as multipart/mixed even when QP encoding
of the text part is turned off.
( :-]) James
Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 12:53:08 +0000
From: James Berriman <J.R.Berriman at staffs.ac dot uk>
Subject: Fantasy island (MIME again)
Hi there,
While I'm on the subject of MIME, a quick reminder that I'd like to be able
to send text/html responses :-)
Likewise, when replying to a GET command, how about returning html archives
as either text/html (the whole message) or (better) multipart with the
archive text in a text/html part? This would allow html-enabled mailers
like Netscape to display the html archive correctly.
Diving off the deep end: how about a set of /=Content- tokens?
Actually, what I'd really like is the ability to add a bunch of attachments
to an autoresponse. So you might have files in a folder like this:
default
A plain text file
token in file:
/=Content-Type text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
default.1
An html attachment
token:
/=Content-Type text/html; charset="iso-????"
default.2
A binhex attachment
tokens:
/=Content-Type application/mac-binhex40; name="my file"
/=Content-Disposition attachment; filename="my file"
default.3
A base 64 encoded image
tokens:
/=Content-Type image/gif; name="picture.GIF"
/=Content-Disposition attachment; filename="picture.GIF"
/=Content-Transfer-Encoding base64
Well, I'm sure you get the idea. AutoShare could build a complete multipart
response from the individual files.
Perhaps there's an easier way. Anyone? ;-)
( :-]) James
Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 07:49:01 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Digest
At 02:05 +0000 4/11/1997, Vince wrote:
>I had an interesting thing happen today. Someone subscribed to one of my
>lists and Autoshare sent them the complete digest. It was about 500k and
>was rejected by hotmail. What got turned on to have Autoshare send them the
>digest with a simple sub command? I have never had this happen before ? I
>checked their original request, and it was a simple, sub <listname>
><yourname>
When your subscription request has been approved, you are also sent a
partial digest to get a headstart (if I remember correctly, 1.4.2 lists
"Partial digest" in the subject of the mail). The size of this partial
digest depends on how busy your list is, but basically it goes back to the
time that digests were last sent out and at the same time initialized on
the server. Digests are often sent out and initialized every day, so I am a
little baffled as to how a partial digest can hold as much as 500K :-)
Either you keep much longer digest intervals, or the list contributions are
very long, or you keep a very busy list!
Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 10:49:53 -0600
From: "Tom A. Moberg" <TMoberg at miph dot org>
Subject: Bounce question
If I have set up my Bounce address to be my general postmaster account, and
I have the bounce directive set to OFF, what is supposed to happen to
messages that bounce back? I don't have that much traffic and decided to
take the advice of the balloon help and 'handle bounces myself', but now I
am not sure bounces will actually be handled in any fashion.
For what it is worth the postmaster account just forwards messages to my
regular account address.
Thanks,
Tom
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Tom A. Moberg -- Telecommunications Coordinator
MN Star of the North Prevention Coalition -- http://www.miph.org/star
a project of the MN Institute of Public Health -- http://www.miph.org
voice: (612) 427-5310 fax: (612) 427-7841
email: tmoberg at miph dot org
Date: 04 Nov 97 10:56:40 -0600
From: Chuck Boody <chuck_boody at hopkins.k12.mn dot us>
Subject: Autoshare or QM Pro bug??
See the two notes below about my problems with message + enclosures sent
from Autoshare to QM Pro clients using EIMS 1.1.2. Recall that what I
want the system to do is exactly what it did do when Mike Scudamore removed
the MIME-Version header.
These two folks, who are very knowledgable, seem to indicate the problem
is within Autoshare. I don't care to get into whether one piece of
software of another is at fault, I just want them to work together.
My question then is simple: Can I get rid of that MIME header so that
the message and enclosure will be properly interpreted by QMPro? Anyone
want to tell me how to do this? Mikael? I'm on digest, so won't see
responses until tomorrow unless you mail direct.
Again, if you want to examine the message and enclosure yourself send
mail to:
mailit at stumail.hopkins.k12.mn dot us
with
Addressbook2
in the Subject line.
Thanks for any help you can give. This is a fairly crucial capability
for us as we transition to POP3 with QMPro and Eudora both being used as
clients.
Chuck Boody
chuck_boody at hopkins.k12.mn dot us
==============
Mike Scudamore wrote:
>
>
>I grabbed the address book again from Chuck's site. For testing
purposes,
>all of my mail is aliased to two different usernames so I can always go
>back and retrieve the original message before QMP dorks it up. I deleted
>the "MIME-Version: 1.0" header, stuck it back into the "scud" file,
>retrieved the message with QMP, and the damn code asked me if I wanted
to
>install
>the address book that I just received as an enclosure.
>
>The proposed Bug #159 is not a valid "flaw" (although I have plenty more
>to take its place.) This leads me back to the question: Should we expect
>it to do what Eudora does? In this case, I say no, but I'm still open to
>suggestions.
>
>scud
>
>--
>/------------------------------------------------------------------\
>| Mike Scudamore, SPARTA, Inc. | mailto:scud at huntsville.sparta dot com |
>| 4901 Corporate Drive,Ste.102 | Voice: (205)837-5282 Ext. 1504 |
>| Huntsville, AL 35805 | We may doze, but we never close! |
>\------------------------------------------------------------------/
>
>
>Mark Aubinder writes:
>scud writes...
>
>> I deleted the "MIME-Version: 1.0" header, stuck it back into the
"scud"
>> file, retrieved the message with QMP, and the damn code asked me if I
>> wanted to install the address book that I just received as an
enclosure.
>
>So the attachment was not properly MIME-delimited, even though the
message
>was marked as being MIME-encoded? If so, then the mail client's failure
to
>recognize the enclosure is NOT, in my opinion, its fault. I agree with
Mike
>Byrns that if a message is marked as MIME-encoded, it must be reliably
so.
>
>=========================================================================
=
> Mark H. Anbinder |
mha at 14850 dot com
> Public Communications Inc. |
http://14850.com/
> 95 Brown Road Suite 210 |
607-257-1831
> Ithaca, New York 14850 USA | Fax
257-1873
>=========================================================================
=
>
>
Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 21:53:15 +0000
From: James Berriman <james at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk>
Subject: Re: Autoshare or QM Pro bug??
>See the two notes below about my problems with message + enclosures sent
>from Autoshare to QM Pro clients using EIMS 1.1.2. Recall that what I
>want the system to do is exactly what it did do when Mike Scudamore removed
>the MIME-Version header.
Chuck, have you tried setting AutoShare to QP Always? I'd be interested to
hear if it makes a difference.
It appears that QMP doesn't scan the message body for enclosures because
the mime Content-Type: header says it's a text/plain message. QMP is making
the assumption that any binhex in a MIME compliant message will be sent as
a separate part of a multipart/mixed message.
Removing the "MIME-Version: 1.0" header sidesteps that assumption.
>>The proposed Bug #159 is not a valid "flaw" (although I have plenty more
>>to take its place.) This leads me back to the question: Should we expect
>>it to do what Eudora does? In this case, I say no, but I'm still open to
>>suggestions.
>>
>>scud
The whole point of binhex is that it's a text-encoded format for
distributing binary files between mac users. As it's just wrapped text, you
can _manually_ paste a binhex file directly into your message body
(bypassing any attachment process altogether) and savvy clients like Eudora
will happily decode it at the other end. I just pasted a binhexed MIDI file
into the middle of a message and sent it to myself. Eudora handled it
perfectly. Personally, I consider that a useful feature :-)
If the client sees this:
Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 14:00:24 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: QM Pro bug??
At 14:48 -0600 29/10/1997, Chuck Boody wrote:
>The procedure seems to work correctly for text files, but not when I
>have an enclosure to send.
Thanks to Chuck, from whom I have now received a test message file. As the
message includes no sign of MIME, it is not a MIME boundary lines thing as
I first suspected.
I updated the message file to reflect myself as a recipient and put it in
my EIMS 1.2 Incoming Mail folder. When my Eudora client received the mail,
the enclosure handling was perfect :-) The conclusion appears to be that
the QM Pro client somehow doesn't support an aspect of enclosure handling
that Eudora does. You may want to ask the QM folks to perform a similar
test. And then do it the same way with the QM Pro client.
Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 14:22:26 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Autoshare or QM Pro bug??
At 21:53 +0000 4/11/1997, James Berriman wrote:
>Chuck, have you tried setting AutoShare to QP Always? I'd be interested to
>hear if it makes a difference.
It shouldn't, but QP Always should!
>I just pasted a binhexed MIDI file into the middle of a message and sent it
>to myself. Eudora handled it perfectly. Personally, I consider that a useful
>feature :-)
So do I. Ever since Glenn told me about it a couple of years ago :-)
>If the client sees this:
>
>
>** The AutoShare-Talk archives are at:
>** <http://frutiger.staffs.ac.uk/autoshare/archives/AutoShare-Talk/>
Date: 04 Nov 97 18:04:08 -0600
From: Chuck Boody <chuck_boody at hopkins.k12.mn dot us>
Subject: Re: Autoshare or QM Pro bug??
Help guys!
>Chuck, have you tried setting AutoShare to QP Always? I'd be interested
to
>hear if it makes a difference.
You just wandered off into jargon I don't understand. What's QP Always
and how do I set it?????
Chuck Boody
BTW Isn't jargon wonderful. Here's some for you: The sub-mediant is
frequently used as a pivotal chord in modulations, but can also function
as a
temporary tonic chord. It is also useful in chromatic modulation. (Can
you tell I was a musicologist in a previous life ;->? )
Chuck
Date: Wed, 5 Nov 1997 00:37:36 +0000
From: James Berriman <james at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk>
Subject: Re: Autoshare or QM Pro bug??
At 22:22 04/11/97, Mikael Hansen wrote:
>At 21:53 +0000 4/11/1997, James Berriman wrote:
>>** The AutoShare-Talk archives are at:
>>** <http://frutiger.staffs.ac.uk/autoshare/archives/AutoShare-Talk/>
>
>** The AutoShare-Talk archives are at:
>** <http://frutiger.staffs.ac.uk/autoshare/archives/AutoShare-Talk/>
Date: Wed, 5 Nov 1997 00:37:48 +0000
From: James Berriman <james at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk>
Subject: Re: Autoshare or QM Pro bug??
At 00:04 05/11/97, Chuck Boody wrote:
>BTW Isn't jargon wonderful. Here's some for you: The sub-mediant is
>frequently used as a pivotal chord in modulations, but can also function
>as a
>temporary tonic chord. It is also useful in chromatic modulation. (Can
>you tell I was a musicologist in a previous life ;->? )
>
>Chuck
I always find the best way to see major problems like this is to look upon
them as more of a minor one.
If you get my drift ;-)
Sorry I can't remember which menu the MIME options hide under. I'm sure
Mikael can give us a pointer :-)
( :-]) James
Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 16:55:17 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Autoshare or QM Pro bug??
At 17:49 -0600 4/11/1997, Chuck Boody wrote:
>You just wandered off into jargon I don't understand. What's QP Always
>and how do I set it?????
Drag the AutoShare server application onto the Script Editor, single-click
on Misc Options (lower left) and look for the MIME property halfway down to
the right; you can use the SetMisc command to change it.
Or easier: in the Admin, do Command-J bringing up the More Miscellaneous
window and find the MIME series of radio buttons. See also the balloon
help. (Be sure to use 1.4.2 version of both the server and the Admin!)
Chuck just sent me a mail off the list, indicating that his test file does
in fact have a MIME 1.0 line as the very first line (no QP stuff though).
Ooops... Sorry that I missed that one. This does change things.
Is there a reason that your clients have MIME on and QP off? QP btw is
Quoted-Printable, which takes care of those funny accent characters etc in
the body.
Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 17:07:57 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Autoshare or QM Pro bug??
At 00:37 +0000 5/11/1997, James Berriman wrote:
>This is fun. Notice how the AutoShare footer got inserted before the binhex
>blurb both times :-) The next question is: Why?
>
>Fascinating!
We aim to please :-)
I wondered about that too. My guess is that AutoShare at some point checks
to see if the Binhex header string is in the line rather than beginning it.
And as an enclosure is put at the end of a non-MIME message, the footer is
inserted just in front of it. Makes sense?
Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 19:49:44 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Bounce question
At 10:49 -0600 4/11/1997, Tom A. Moberg wrote:
>If I have set up my Bounce address to be my general postmaster account, and
>I have the bounce directive set to OFF, what is supposed to happen to
>messages that bounce back? I don't have that much traffic and decided to
>take the advice of the balloon help and 'handle bounces myself', but now I
>am not sure bounces will actually be handled in any fashion.
>
>For what it is worth the postmaster account just forwards messages to my
>regular account address.
OFF means that the SMTP envelope sender for outgoing messages won't be
updated to the bounce address. So for instance if you post a list
contribution, all bounces are directed to the original sender (you!), which
is not recommended.
EMPTY is better as the SMTP envelope sender is updated to an empty string,
so bounces have nowhere to go.
ON is best as all bounces are directed to an address dedicated to accepting
bounces.
Date: 05 Nov 97 07:57:37 -0600
From: Chuck Boody <chuck_boody at hopkins.k12.mn dot us>
Subject: Re: Autoshare or QM Pro bug??
Turning on Quote Printable Always solves the problem of proper delivery
of an enclosure from Qutoshare to QM Pro. Thanks to Mikael, Mike, Mark and
James and the others who help track this down. Life is better for me...
Back to lurking...for a while anyway ;->.
Chuck Boody
========
Mikael Hansen wrote:
>At 17:49 -0600 4/11/1997, Chuck Boody wrote:
>
>>You just wandered off into jargon I don't understand. What's QP Always
>>and how do I set it?????
>
>Drag the AutoShare server application onto the Script Editor,
single-click
>on Misc Options (lower left) and look for the MIME property halfway down
to
>the right; you can use the SetMisc command to change it.
>
>Or easier: in the Admin, do Command-J bringing up the More Miscellaneous
>window and find the MIME series of radio buttons. See also the balloon
>help. (Be sure to use 1.4.2 version of both the server and the Admin!)
>
>Chuck just sent me a mail off the list, indicating that his test file
does
>in fact have a MIME 1.0 line as the very first line (no QP stuff
though).
>Ooops... Sorry that I missed that one. This does change things.
>
>Is there a reason that your clients have MIME on and QP off? QP btw is
>Quoted-Printable, which takes care of those funny accent characters etc
in
>the body.
>
>
>>Mike Scudamore wrote
>I grabbed the address book again from Chuck's site. For testing
purposes,
>all of my mail is aliased to two different usernames so I can always go
>back and retrieve the original message before QMP dorks it up. I deleted
>the "MIME-Version: 1.0" header, stuck it back into the "scud" file,
>retrieved the message with QMP, and the damn code asked me if I wanted
to
>install
>the address book that I just received as an enclosure.
>
>The proposed Bug #159 is not a valid "flaw" (although I have plenty more
>to take its place.) This leads me back to the question: Should we expect
>it to do what Eudora does? In this case, I say no, but I'm still open to
>suggestions.
>
>RFC822 header
>-----------------------------------
>
>Received: from hopf.dnai.com (140.174.162.10) by hopkins.k12.mn.us
> with ESMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 1.2); Tue, 4 Nov 1997 18:55:03
-0600
>Received: from [140.174.162.228] (dnai-140-174-162-228.dialup.dnai.com
>[140.174.162.228])
> by hopf.dnai.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA23668;
> Tue, 4 Nov 1997 16:55:15 -0800 (PST)
>X-Sender: meh at pop.dnai dot com
>Message-Id: <v04002307b0856dfe5820 at [140.174.162 dot 228]>
>In-Reply-To: <1333456710-64948285 at hopkins.k12.mn dot us>
>Mime-Version: 1.0
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 16:55:17 -0800
>To: "AutoShare-Talk" <AutoShare-Talk at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk>
>From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
>Subject: Re: Autoshare or QM Pro bug??
>Cc: Chuck Boody <chuck_boody at hopkins.k12.mn dot us>
>
Date: Wed, 5 Nov 1997 14:53:47 +0000
From: James Berriman <james at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk>
Subject: Re: Autoshare or QM Pro bug??
Chuck quoted Mikael:
>Is there a reason that your clients have MIME on and QP off? QP btw is
>Quoted-Printable, which takes care of those funny accent characters etc
Eudora only uses QP encoding if there are actually long lines or illegal
characters in the message. Most of my messages are therefore mime
text/plain with no quoted-printable encoding :-)
I imagine other clients do the same (it would appear that QMP does!).
(BTW, I forced AutoShare to send me a multipart mime response by using an =
é
character in my request).
( :-]) James
Date: Wed, 5 Nov 1997 16:17:26 +0000
From: James Berriman <james at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk>
Subject: Eudora quirk
Further to the QMP discussion, I just noticed that Eudora Pro 2 never
displays the "Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable" header in
received messages, even with 'blah blah' turned on.
I had no idea that Eudora actually hid/discarded some message headers
permanently.
( :-]) James
Date: 06 Nov 97 08:20:30 -0600
From: Chuck Boody <chuck_boody at hopkins.k12.mn dot us>
Subject: RE: AutoShare-Talk digest 6 Nov 1997
>From: James Berriman <james at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk>
>(BTW, I forced AutoShare to send me a multipart mime response by using an =
é
>character in my request).
>
>( :-]) James
OK James, once more you've peeked (peaked?) my interest. Are you implying =
that I could get AutoShare to send me several inclosures by addressing it =
in some fashion? Or are you saying only that it would treat message plus =
enclosure as a multipart MIME response?
Some clarification and details please.
Thanks,
Chuck Boody
Date: Thu, 6 Nov 1997 12:53:20 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Mostly Eudora
At 16:17 +0000 5/11/1997, James Berriman wrote:
>Further to the QMP discussion, I just noticed that Eudora Pro 2 never
>displays the "Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable" header in
>received messages, even with 'blah blah' turned on.
Once the received mail is stored in the mail client, it's decoded and as
such no longer QP. It's not just 2.x versions btw.
At 14:53 +0000 5/11/1997, James Berriman wrote:
>Eudora only uses QP encoding if there are actually long lines or illegal
>characters in the message. Most of my messages are therefore mime
>text/plain with no quoted-printable encoding :-)
And perhaps no enclosures either. So why the "Mime-Version: 1.0" field,
when it doesn't appear to be needed? It has come to my attention that it
merely leaves less guessing from the beginning. That is why Chuck's clien=
ts
have the field in the header, and also why AutoShare needs some work
distinguishing minimum MIME from QP enabled.
At 12:32 +0000 4/11/1997, James Berriman wrote:
>Still, I'm sure there is a Very Good Case(TM) to be made for sending
>responses with binhex attachments as multipart/mixed even when QP encodi=
ng
>of the text part is turned off.
Exactly. And requiring QP Always in AutoShare isn't clean enough, as it i=
s
an overkill.
At 08:20 -0600 6/11/1997, Chuck Boody wrote:
>>From: James Berriman <james at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk>
>
>>(BTW, I forced AutoShare to send me a multipart mime response by using =
an é
>>character in my request).
>OK James, once more you've peeked (peaked?) my interest. Are you implyi=
ng
>that I could get AutoShare to send me several inclosures by addressing i=
t
>in some fashion? Or are you saying only that it would treat message plu=
s
>enclosure as a multipart MIME response?
The latter. When an extended character is in the body, the QP setting
turned on by the user gets activated, otherwise there is no need for it.
(James's Fantasy island is another story for later...)
Date: 06 Nov 97 15:23:32 -0600
From: Chuck Boody <chuck_boody at hopkins.k12.mn dot us>
Subject: FWD: RE:Still a QMP issue(was-RE: Autoshare or QM Pro bug??)
The message below is forwarded from the QM-l listserv and is for the
information of folks on this list. I suspect the writer may know what he is
talking about, but I am not going to guarantee it. Perhaps Mikael or
others may want to comment.
Chuck Boody
--------------------------------------
Date: 11/6/97 2:35 PM
From: Mike Byrns
RE:Still a QMP issue(was-RE: Autoshare or QM Pro bug??)
On 11/6/97, qm-l wrote:
>
>Mike Byrns wrote:
>
>>It's not changing to Quoted Printable encoding that will fix it. It's
>changing
>>the forwarded message behavior to it's not stuck into an enclosure of
>type
>>message/rfc822. This is a MIME method for forwards and it's quite a
>good
>>idea as
>>long as the recipient can handle it. Truth is many mailers can't.
>>QuickMail Pro
>>is one of them.
>>
>Ah but changing to Quote Printable did in fact solve the problem. I
>think you are saying that that is not the appropriate solution. Am I
correct?
>
One problem is with MIME-Version: 1.0 being added to the headers of a
message
whose enclosures are not in MIME format. This was a problem with the Mac
list
server software (was it called Autoshare?). Turning on some
quoted-printable
option in the list server software apparently makes the server behave
correctly.
The other problem is with a message in MIME format that contains a
forwarded
message in a message/rfc822 format instead of just having the original
text quoted
as with normal replies. QuickMail does not explicitly support the
message/rfc822 MIME type so it displays the forwarded message as an
attachment. Instructing
the DEC TeamLinks SMTP gateway not to enclose forwarded messages in
message/rfc822 parts should solve the problem.
These are two problems that on the surface appear similar but stem from
two
different roots.
RFC822 header
-----------------------------------
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Date: 06 Nov 97 14:35:54 -0600
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Precedence: bulk
From: Mike Byrns <mike.byrns at cesoft dot com>
To: "qm-l" <qm-l at lists.yale dot edu>
Subject: RE:Still a QMP issue(was-RE: Autoshare or QM Pro bug??)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-Ascii"
X-Mailer: QuickMail Pro 1.5.2a1 (Windows32)
X-Priority: 3
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Date: Thu, 6 Nov 1997 19:39:12 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Still a QMP issue
At 12:53 -0800 6/11/1997, Mikael Hansen wrote:
>AutoShare needs some work distinguishing minimum MIME from QP enabled.
To re-word: with respect to enclosures, AutoShare needs to acknowledge
minimum MIME as different and inbetween non-MIME and MIME QP.
At 15:23 -0600 6/11/1997, Chuck Boody wrote:
>The message below is forwarded from the QM-l listserv and is for the
>information of folks on this list. I suspect the writer may know what
>he is talking about, but I am not going to guarantee it. Perhaps Mikael
>or others may want to comment.
>From: Mike Byrns
>One problem is with MIME-Version: 1.0 being added to the headers of a
>message whose enclosures are not in MIME format. This was a problem with
>the Mac list server software (was it called Autoshare?). Turning on some
>quoted-printable option in the list server software apparently makes the
>server behave correctly.
Correct. QP Always is still an overkill though.
Subject: Problems with lost subscriptions
Date: Fri, 7 Nov 97 14:46:12 +0000
From: Jed <jed at psy.herts.ac dot uk>
Hi,
Has anyone had the situation whereby users who have been subscribed to a
list (and working fine) for a relatively long time suddenly find
themselves de-subscribed, only to be told that they ARE actually
subscribed when they acknowledge the servers response by trying to
resubscribing. Future communications with the server are OK from this
point on!!
This has happened on a number of occasions and is completely bizarre. I
would be extremely interested if anyone knows what may be the problem.
Jed
phone: +44 (0) 1707.284635
Fax: +44 (0) 1707.285073
mailto://jed at psy.herts.ac dot uk
Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 18:33:34 +0000
From: James Berriman <james at frutiger.staffs.ac dot uk>
Subject: Re: Problems with lost subscriptions
At 14:46 07/11/97, Jed wrote:
>Hi,
>
>Has anyone had the situation whereby users who have been subscribed to a
>list (and working fine) for a relatively long time suddenly find
>themselves de-subscribed, only to be told that they ARE actually
>subscribed when they acknowledge the servers response by trying to
>resubscribing. Future communications with the server are OK from this
>point on!!
>
>This has happened on a number of occasions and is completely bizarre. I
>would be extremely interested if anyone knows what may be the problem.
I had a very similar problem with one subscriber. She wasn't getting mail
(not sure why). I didn't get any bounces from that address, either.
Using email admin, I unsubscribed one address (which should have reached
her OK) and resubscribed her with another, but she still wasn't receiving
anything. Then she tried subscribing (from the address I'd just subscribed
to the list the previous day) and succeeded. From that point on, everything
worked fine.
Never got to the bottom of it, but she's using Simeon (IMAP client) and
moved from one site to another recently, which involved some problems with
her mail configuration.
Since I have been unable to reproduce the problem, I had put it down to
broken mail aliases. Many people have envelope addresses (return path)
which don't correspond to their From: header. That's fine as long as the
return path does correspond to their active email account (which it
should). If the in/outgoing smtp server that handles their mail is
misconfigured, mail bounces and AutoShare messages can suddenly start
hitting the bit bucket (or better still, a mailbox they no longer use...).
Since mail addressed to the From: address still gets to them, they don't
know that there's anything wrong!
Your experience would tend to suggest that there's a little more to it than
that. Anyone else had problems like this?
( :-]) James
Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 12:40:53 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Problems with lost subscriptions
At 14:46 +0000 7/11/1997, Jed wrote:
>Has anyone had the situation whereby users who have been subscribed to a
>list (and working fine) for a relatively long time suddenly find
>themselves de-subscribed, only to be told that they ARE actually
>subscribed when they acknowledge the servers response by trying to
>resubscribing.
Do you by de-subscribed mean that they are no longer receiving list mail?
You would want to look up the person's address in the main list file. If
that's OK, then compare the main list file with the .m(essage) and
.d(igest) files.
Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 23:53:21 -0500
From: Jonathan Shaw <jls4 at cwru dot edu>
Subject: Handling Re: messages
I have a strange request/question, I think. I am running a few humor
mailing lists. One is moderated and the other is set to "Subscribers."
Anyway, I just changed that list last night and there have been a bunch of
non-joke messages sent out by people. They were replying to other messages
and well, it's just a big mess. My mail server, SIMS, is overrun with all
the mail, too. This is because there are about 2500 subscribers and a
couple are non-deliverable, but SIMS keeps the whole recipient list in
memory, anyway. That's a whole different story, though.
What I would like to be able to do is prevent postings which contain Re: in
the subject. Any easy way to do this? It would help cut down on a LOT of
traffic.
BTW, I'd love to be able to create a response to Re: posts which explains
why they did not get posted.
In the meantime, I've set replies to go to sender instead of list.
-Jonathan {;-)
<http://b62968.cwru.edu/>
Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 06:44:00 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Handling Re: messages
At 23:53 -0500 11/11/1997, Jonathan Shaw wrote:
>I have a strange request/question, I think. I am running a few humor
>mailing lists. One is moderated and the other is set to "Subscribers."
>Anyway, I just changed that list last night and there have been a bunch of
>non-joke messages sent out by people. They were replying to other messages
>and well, it's just a big mess.
That does happen, if subscribers are suddenly allowed to post :-)
>My mail server, SIMS, is overrun with all
>the mail, too. This is because there are about 2500 subscribers and a
>couple are non-deliverable, but SIMS keeps the whole recipient list in
>memory, anyway. That's a whole different story, though.
That is some list you have there! AutoShare btw does not keep all
subscribers in memory at any one given time, thereby not requiring more
memory due to large lists, and yet it keeps being pretty fast.
>What I would like to be able to do is prevent postings which contain Re: in
>the subject. Any easy way to do this? It would help cut down on a LOT of
>traffic.
You can create a filter file named after the list, put it in the Filters
folder and add a line such as
Subject: Re:
which should suppress all list contributions containing Re: to that list.
>BTW, I'd love to be able to create a response to Re: posts which explains
>why they did not get posted.
That is a good suggestion, which I have noted. While this type of handling
takes place in a number of other situations, specific filters merely kill
the filtered messages as it stands currently.
Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 20:52:33 -0500
From: Jonathan Shaw <jls4 at cwru dot edu>
Subject: Re: AutoShare-Talk digest 13 Nov 1997
>>I have a strange request/question, I think. I am running a few humor
>>mailing lists. One is moderated and the other is set to "Subscribers."
>>Anyway, I just changed that list last night and there have been a bunch of
>>non-joke messages sent out by people. They were replying to other messages
>>and well, it's just a big mess.
>
>That does happen, if subscribers are suddenly allowed to post :-)
Yeah, but I feel that I have some of the most incompetent subscribership of
any mailing list on the Internet. They are all replying (to the list!) to
complain that they are getting the same mail over and over because they are
not reading passed the <list>.Header file. :) I changed it to a footer...
and made the list reply to sender for right now, but that first e-mail I
sent when it was unmoderated has caused all kinds of havoc. :)
>>My mail server, SIMS, is overrun with all
>>the mail, too. This is because there are about 2500 subscribers and a
>>couple are non-deliverable, but SIMS keeps the whole recipient list in
>>memory, anyway. That's a whole different story, though.
>That is some list you have there! AutoShare btw does not keep all
>subscribers in memory at any one given time, thereby not requiring more
>memory due to large lists, and yet it keeps being pretty fast.
This is a main reason why I wanted to try AutoShare. Plus, its own memory
requirements are very small, it has some cool features like the automatic
bounce handler (which doesn't catch very many, but I guess it helps a
little).
SIMS, on the other hand, is currently giving me a headache. :) I like it (a
lot!), and it's a big improvement over EIMS, sometimes... But it makes the
computer very unresponsive for ME (to use other apps) while it is handling
more than 2 or 3 outgoing messages in the queue. And by in the queue, I
just mean they are in the queue folder (and therefore the recipient list is
in RAM). They don't have to be sending for me to be slow, only one has to
be for the slowness to occur. I've asked Vlad to make SIMS purge the
addresses of recipients that have failed out completely or successfully
sent, so that a mailing to 2500 people where only one host was unreachable
will not cause the other 2499 people to stay in RAM and slow things down.
They are working on that for a future version.
>You can create a filter file named after the list, put it in the Filters
>folder and add a line such as
>
>Subject: Re:
>
>which should suppress all list contributions containing Re: to that list.
This would be bad as I'd like to be able to read what they've sent, too. I
may just do that, like you said, but also have the SIMS settings to forward
mail to me. In other words, mail that goes to humor-sick@b62968 will be
moved to the filed mail folder and also forwarded to me (by SIMS, not
AutoShare). I'll set a filter in Eudora to capture things from that point.
Thanks a bunch for your speedy reply, Mikael!
-Jonathan {;-)
<http://b62968.cwru.edu/>
Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 09:27:16 -0800
From: Camelot Administrator <camelot.admin at lmco dot com>
Subject: Help! - Wacky things happening in OS 8
I cannot verify that it is OS 8, but I just upgraded our server to OS 8,
and at the same time, I added one more mailing list.
Autoshare is currently dead in the water. It is stuck on "File to process:
Icon".
In AutoShare Admin, I noticed two new entries in the list window. One is
blank, and one is called "Icon". I did not put them there... they just
showed up. I am unable to delete them as well. I have quit Autoshare and
restarted it, but they are still there, and Autoshare is still stuck on
"File to process: Icon".
I need help desparately. All my lists are currently inoperable.
Many thanks in advance,
Bill Catambay
+----------------------------------------------------------------+
| Bill Catambay, Software Developer, Webmaster |
| Lockheed Martin, Enterprise Information Systems, Sunnyvale, CA |
| WORK -> mailto:bill.m.catambay at lmco dot com |
| HOME -> mailto:bill at catambay dot com |
| |
| Pascal Central -> http://www.catambay.com/pascal-central |
| Macintosh Guild -> http://www.rahul.net/rrk/lmms/mac |
+----------------------------------------------------------------+
Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 09:37:59 -0800
From: Camelot Administrator <camelot.admin at lmco dot com>
Subject: Re: Help! - Wacky things happening in OS 8
Regarding the following note I posted earlier, I found out how to resolve
it. It may very well be an OS 8 issue. Using ResEdit, you will notice
that in each folder there is an invisible file called "Icon". That would
explain the mysterious "Icon" list, and the mysterious "Icon" post. I went
into both Filed Mail and LS folders, made the Icon file visible, and then
deleted them. Lo and behold, the Icon list disappeared, and Autoshare was
no longer stuck trying to process the Icon post.
I believe that the invisible Icon file existed in previous OS's, but maybe
the file type has changed to the point that Autoshare is now trying to
process the file. Just thought you all might be interested in this little
tidbit. Had me pretty worried for about 10 minutes. :)
Bill
<< start of forwarded material >>
Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 09:27:16 -0800
From: Camelot Administrator <camelot.admin at lmco dot com>
Subject: Help! - Wacky things happening in OS 8
I cannot verify that it is OS 8, but I just upgraded our server to OS 8,
and at the same time, I added one more mailing list.
Autoshare is currently dead in the water. It is stuck on "File to process:
Icon".
In AutoShare Admin, I noticed two new entries in the list window. One is
blank, and one is called "Icon". I did not put them there... they just
showed up. I am unable to delete them as well. I have quit Autoshare and
restarted it, but they are still there, and Autoshare is still stuck on
"File to process: Icon".
I need help desparately. All my lists are currently inoperable.
Many thanks in advance,
Bill Catambay
<< end of forwarded material >>
+----------------------------------------------------------------+
| Bill Catambay, Software Developer, Webmaster |
| Lockheed Martin, Enterprise Information Systems, Sunnyvale, CA |
| WORK -> mailto:bill.m.catambay at lmco dot com |
| HOME -> mailto:bill at catambay dot com |
| |
| Pascal Central -> http://www.catambay.com/pascal-central |
| Macintosh Guild -> http://www.rahul.net/rrk/lmms/mac |
+----------------------------------------------------------------+
Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 14:51:13 -0500
From: Jonathan Shaw <jls4 at cwru dot edu>
Subject: Some feature requests... success story..
Is anyone besides me interested in an AutoShare feature that would
periodically confirm subscribership? i.e., to stay subscribed, you'd have
to reply to that e-mail, much the same way the subscribe confirmation works
right now. I'd like to send something like that to all of my subscribers
every few months. Partially, this is because they are a bunch of morons
(apparently) and don't even know how they subscribed (they forgot or
something). Partially, this is to help remove the harder to remove bounces
(where user names aren't shown, that type of thing).
The major differences between this periodic confirm procedure and the
current one is that this one is periodic :), it sends to all subscribers,
and the subscribers continue to receive list postings even while AutoShare
hasn't yet received the confirmation back yet--until it has timed out; then
they are unsubscribed. The idea of periodic posting is already built-in,
too, with the month. files... And since I get the impression that Mikael
has a great working knowledge of data structures (he uses quicksort,
posting works in O(n) time, based on memory requirements the program seems
to use external search routines instead of loading the whole file at once,
and so on...)
Also, is there a way for me to teach AutoShare some more bounce formats? I
don't mind using ResEdit to do so... I got 1639 unresolved bounces and 109
hard bounces yesterday, alone. That wasn't because the people weren't
reachable... AutoShare allowed a message with an improperly formatted From:
line to be posted to the list. It was something like "My Name Here
<myusername at mysite dot com>. Notice the missing closed quotation. SIMS also
didn't have a problem with this (I wouldn't expect it to), but lots of
other servers did, apparently. :)
Needless to say, I've had a lot of problems with my mailing list since
making it unmoderated... I have switched it back since in two days 44
messages were posted, only about 8 or 9 of those being jokes (I run humor
mailing lists). I've got a bunch of idiots for subscribers.
If anyone is curious as to how SIMS held up during all this... well, at
some points the queue folder contained as many as 1700 items. This is a lot
for SIMS, since it stores only one copy of each message, regardless of the
number of recipients. It made my computer slow to a crawl, though.
Actually, having 3 large recipient messages transferring makes it go slow.
But, I think EIMS would have crashed a long time ago, and SIMS usually
doesn't crash (versions 1.3 and 1.5, though--version 1.4.x had some
problems). And, for those curious, based on readings in TCP Watcher, I
don't think SIMS ever made it above 20-30 open connections, though it was
set for 250 at times. EIMS was able to open more connections, but was less
efficient in disk handling. SIMS is very inefficient in memory
handling--(it doesn't purge successfully sent e-mail addresses from RAM
until the whole recipient list has been successful or has failed out
because of the number of retries being too high, and only then it purges
while the computer is idle enough for it to have time to do whatever the
heck it is doing.
-Jonathan {;-)
<http://b62968.cwru.edu/>
Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 12:48:39 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Some feature requests... success story..
At 14:51 -0500 14/11/1997, Jonathan Shaw wrote:
>Is anyone besides me interested in an AutoShare feature that would
>periodically confirm subscribership? i.e., to stay subscribed, you'd have
>to reply to that e-mail, much the same way the subscribe confirmation works
>right now. I'd like to send something like that to all of my subscribers
>every few months.
That is a good suggestion. I'll look into it. Would you like the
confirmation to be triggered by a date for all or by a date specific to the
subscriber? The former would be easier at this time.
>Also, is there a way for me to teach AutoShare some more bounce formats?
Yes, send complete samples of your most common, not yet supported bounces
to meh at dnai dot com, and I'll see what I can do about it. It might very well be
that 90% of your unresolved bounces have the same 2-3 formats.
>Needless to say, I've had a lot of problems with my mailing list since
>making it unmoderated... I have switched it back since in two days 44
>messages were posted, only about 8 or 9 of those being jokes (I run humor
>mailing lists). I've got a bunch of idiots for subscribers.
I haven't forgotten about filtered contributions being mailed the admin :-)
>I don't think SIMS ever made it above 20-30 open connections, though it was
>set for 250 at times. EIMS was able to open more connections, but was less
>efficient in disk handling.
You may want to bring this up on the SIMS and EIMS-L lists.
Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 12:51:26 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Help! - Wacky things happening in OS 8
At 09:37 -0800 14/11/1997, Camelot Administrator wrote:
>I went into both Filed Mail and LS folders, made the Icon file visible,
>and then deleted them. Lo and behold, the Icon list disappeared, and
>Autoshare was no longer stuck trying to process the Icon post.
Thanks for bringing this up!
Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 20:36:34 -0500
From: Jonathan Shaw <jls4 at cwru dot edu>
Subject: Re: Some feature requests... success story..
>From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
>Subject: Re: Some feature requests... success story..
>
>At 14:51 -0500 14/11/1997, Jonathan Shaw wrote:
>>Is anyone besides me interested in an AutoShare feature that would
>>periodically confirm subscribership? i.e., to stay subscribed, you'd have
>>to reply to that e-mail, much the same way the subscribe confirmation works
>>right now. I'd like to send something like that to all of my subscribers
>>every few months.
>That is a good suggestion. I'll look into it. Would you like the
>confirmation to be triggered by a date for all or by a date specific to the
>subscriber? The former would be easier at this time.
I hadn't considered the per subscriber method (though that sounds like a
cool idea)... But, the date for all method sounds fine to me! It would be
great if there were a customizable file that it sent for this, too.
That just made me think of another question... Is it possible to make list
specific mailback confirmation files by using the mailback.listname method?
This is really not a big deal at all, it would just be cool.
Another suggestion is to add the name of the list after the words
"AutoShare Report" this will make it easier for me to distinguish which
reports went with which lists. Perhaps the main report can be called
AutoShare Report Administrative (or Main, or Complete, ...)
And one more question (are you sick of me yet! :) I was using Macjordomo
before I converted to AutoShare. I found a little freeware app to quickly
rename the hundreds of digest files (to add .text so a web browser displays
them correctly). I've asked AutoShare to put its digests in the same
directory. I don't expect AutoShare to go back and catalogue all of Macj's
digests and make .toc's and everything... but I was just curious--when
someone uses the e-mail search tool, will it search Macj's files, too? And
will it let them "get" them? Usually people do their searching through the
web and get digests by FTP, so this is not a big deal if it is not already
in AutoShare.
-Jonathan {;-)
<http://b62968.cwru.edu/>
Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 03:54:52 -0500
From: Jonathan Shaw <jls4 at cwru dot edu>
Subject: multiple moderators
Currently, I see only one blank for filling in a moderator's name. Is there
a way to enter multiple moderators? I think I may be adding a little level
of complication, though, in that I want contributions to be sent to only
the main moderator. I want to rotate through moderators on a bi-weekly
basis, so that the workload is pretty evenly divided between them. However,
if a moderator gets backed up with mail that s/he can't finish by the time
I have switched over to the next moderator, I would still like him/her to
be able to post the message without having to use the post command.
-Jonathan {;-)
<http://b62968.cwru.edu/>
Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 04:12:34 -0500
From: Jonathan Shaw <jls4 at cwru dot edu>
Subject: address protection
I've got a different mailing list that I'm trying to startup using Address
Protection... But I don't quite understand how it works. Here is a sample
message sent to the list:
X-URL: <http://b62968.cwru.edu/>
Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 03:57:14 -0500
Reply-To: moose-talk at b62968.cwru dot edu (Subscribers of moose-talk)
List-Subscribe: <mailto:autoshare at b62968.cwru dot edu?body=subscribe%20moose-talk>
List-Unsubscribe:
<mailto:autoshare at b62968.cwru dot edu?body=unsubscribe%20moose-talk>
X-List-Digest:
<mailto:autoshare at b62968.cwru dot edu?body=set%20moose-talk%20digest>
List-Software: AutoShare 1.4.2 by Mikael Hansen
To: moose-talk at b62968.cwru dot edu (Subscribers of moose-talk)
From: Jonathan Shaw <1332559113 at b62968.cwru dot edu>
Subject: Moose-Talk: This is a test.
This is a test as well as the first message posted to Moose-Talk!
-Jonathan {;-)
<http://b62968.cwru.edu/>
How would I then send _private mail_ to Jonathan Shaw
<1332559113 at b62968.cwru dot edu> using the address protection feature? Yeah, I
know, I'd be talking to myself. :) I just wanted to make sure I understood
how it worked before other people ask me... and I couldn't figure it out.
The manual says that mail gets addressed to protected@<domain> so I also
tried making a save as files account in SIMS called Protected... but it
didn't help.
-Jonathan {;-)
<http://b62968.cwru.edu/>
Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 08:03:10 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: Some feature requests... success story..
At 20:36 -0500 14/11/1997, Jonathan Shaw wrote:
>That just made me think of another question... Is it possible to make list
>specific mailback confirmation files by using the mailback.listname method?
>This is really not a big deal at all, it would just be cool.
AutoShare is nothing, if not cool :-) It is certainly possible for mails,
whose requests target the same list.
>Another suggestion is to add the name of the list after the words
>"AutoShare Report" this will make it easier for me to distinguish which
>reports went with which lists.
Adding the list name to the subject? Sure.
>I don't expect AutoShare to go back and catalogue all of Macj's digests
>and make .toc's and everything... but I was just curious--when someone
>uses the e-mail search tool, will it search Macj's files, too?
AutoShare will search all archive folder files, whose name ends with .text
and/or .html depending on what the format option is set to.
>And will it let them "get" them? Usually people do their searching
>through the web and get digests by FTP, so this is not a big deal if
>it is not already in AutoShare.
The get command is much like the search command. And if the toc file
doesn't exist, it just isn't added to the return mail. If the toc file does
exist and has a less than proper format, strange things may happen.
The most important thing is when updating the archives and digests, as the
counter in the text/html files depends on the toc files. This pertains to
current files only though and not to older files.
Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 08:03:15 -0800
From: Mikael Hansen <meh at dnai dot com>
Subject: Re: multiple moderators
At 03:54 -0500 15/11/1997, Jonathan Shaw wrote:
>Currently, I see only one blank for filling in a moderator's name. Is there
>a way to enter multiple moderators? I think I may be adding a little level
>of complication, though, in that I want contributions to be sent to only
>the main moderator. I want to rotate through moderators on a bi-weekly
>basis, so that the workload is pretty evenly divided between them. However,
>if a moderator gets backed up with mail that s/he can't finish by the time
>I have switched over to the next moderator, I would still like him/her to
>be able to post the message without having to use the post command.
Moderated lists basically allow only the main listmaster and the
list-specific listmaster to post. If you are the former, perhaps a shared
account would work for latter. What you are asking for is not supported
directly, as only listmasters can be considered valid moderators.
You might also consider configuring the list as a regular subscription list
with the subscriber post option turned off as a default for that list and
then turn on the post option for the various moderators only. It is however
an idea to implement the post option for moderated and announcement lists...